Official Luthiers Forum!

I'd like to build a slothead, just so's I can say, yup, done that.

Can anybody point me toward a source of inexpensive tuners that work well enough? The Great Stew-Mac would love to lighten my bank balance, but somewhere there is a source of serviceable parts that aren't gasp-priced.

Thanks!

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Peter Havriluk

Not sure what your pucker factor is, but - https://www.rubnertuners.com

I used a set of Stew Mac's "Golden Age" 3 to a plate tuners (about $40 or $45 a set), and they have worked fine so far. They're not Waverly quality, but they're still good. I've also used the Grover 18:1 Sta Tites, and I like them a lot.

Dave

I have also been happy with the Golden Age tuners, which are very well priced and look good on instruments of a traditional style. If you want something with more modern styling the Schertlers are great - but more expensive.

Der Jung tuners are great for classics and I suspect their steel string tuners are just as good. You can find them on Ebay, just make sure it's Der Jung (Taiwan) not some junk from China.

My current favorites are the Grover H97-18 individual, 3+3 tuners. Nickel costs around $50, gold costs around $70. If they are of a lower quality than the closest equivalent (and visually identical) Waverly tuners, it is probably not by much, yet the Waverly tuners cost $176 for nickel, $243 for gold. I have installed several sets of the Grovers, and they work great. I don't own any Waverly tuners, but as a player, I just cannot imagine any appreciable performance difference that would justify paying that much more for the Waverly tuners.

I joked with John Hall a few months ago that, instead of buying the Wavery tuners, I would rather buy the Grovers and tape a $100 bill to the back of the headstock. Given the above numbers, I may have to add more folding money (and tape).

Haha... no offense, but I learned a long time ago from furniture making that if I'm going to make a quality project, or in more practical terms, invest around 100 hours of my life into something, I buy really good hardware. In the case of a guitar I equate this to tuners.

For furniture, I only buy from Brusso... unless they don't make what I need. For slotted tuners, I've settled on some custom Gotoh sets that have to be custom ordered from Japan. No only are they expensive, but they take two months to arrive. Blame my designer... but they sure do look and work nice.

I know I didn't answer your direct question. BUT. If you are committed to your project and intended to give it your very best... don't try to skimp on tuners. Buy something worth of the effort you put into the instrument.

Stew Mac's $12 economy slot head tuners work O.K. and have a standard hole spacing so if you decide to upgrade later it is pretty much plug and play. I think Ping offers something similar (but double check the hole spacing).
Slot head steel string tuners are not terribly popular so sometimes you can pick up a set of good quality tuners off of eBay if you search often enough.

I've had more trouble with Waverly steel string tuners than Grover Sta-Tites. John Greven uses Grovers, and he knows a lot more about building guitars than I do! : )

Steel string or nylon?

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formerly known around here as burbank
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http://www.patfosterguitars.com

Assuming you mean steel string, I have used the StewMack Goldens on several guitars where I wanted a vintage plate style. It is important to drill the holes very precisely or there will be some binding. I made a simple little jig



I've also used both Grover and Waverly singles - I don't see any advantage to the Waverlys.

I've had to send several sets of Waverly's back. I don't think I'm going to get anymore of them.

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Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

[quote="

Steel string or nylon?[/quote]

I've had to send several sets of Waverly's back. I don't think I'm going to get anymore of them.[/quote]

I have a set of the individual steel stirng ones with ebony knobs I bought a few years ago and will be using on a current slot head build. Hopefully no issues as even Stew Macs has their limitations.

Rubners with the rollers (bearings) are sublime. Under $150. Some under $100
Not nice. Not good. Sublime.

I've had to send several sets of Waverly's back. I don't think I'm going to get anymore of them.[/quote]

I have a set of the individual steel stirng ones with ebony knobs I bought a few years ago and will be using on a current slot head build. Hopefully no issues as even Stew Macs has their limitations.[/quote]

They were steel string. In each set there was a tuner that was binding, one set out of the box and one set a few months after they were installed. I will say that StewMac allowed me to return the Waverlys with no problems for a full refund.

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Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

I love the Rubners as well! Amazing quality for the price.

I've been using the Waverlies for years, and never had a problem. I'm told that they're very fussy about getting the shaft holes exactly perpendicular to the base, so I'm always careful about that.

I'd put in a vote for the $12 cheapies from Stew-Mac if you're really up against the budget. I used them on my '$100 Challenge' harp guitar to just sneak in under the wire, and they worked fine. I think the quality of the machining on the gears and worms is pretty consistently high these days; what usually distinguishes high end tuners is more solid bearings. You get into trouble when the bearings get loose or wear, and the gear and worm start to chew each other up, but until then they all seem to work well.

I've been using the Schaler Grand Tune singles for my slot heads. Very smooth and good finish on them. Decent price too.

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Tony Thatcher
Bozeman, Montana

Recently I have built two slothead guitars. The first one, which was for me, I used Grover singles. The second one, for a client, had Waverly singles. The client wanted Waverlys. I paid forty something for the Grovers, the Waverlys were close to a hundred and eighty bucks. The Grovers looked as good as the Waverlys and were just as smooth, even though they cost a fourth as much money. I can't see any difference in quality between the two.

The Waverly tuners I used were very nicely made. They offer more options for tuner buttons for those that desire something different.
One comment on the Stew Mac site said they were "like putting a Rolex on your guitar". This may be the attraction for some people. A Casio may keep just as good time, but doesn't have the cachet of a Rolex. Some craftsman may feel the use of more expensive tuners adds to the feeling of quality of their instruments - after all, who would buy Rodgers tuners and put them on a mediocre guitar?

Personally I like Grover's , Schaller's, Gotoh, and several other mid priced brands. I also use Chinese "knock offs" on some of the cheap and cheerful instruments I build.

At the budget end, I've had good luck with the Der Jung tuners, some of which can be had for slotted heads, e.g.
https://www.magic-guitar-parts.com/epages/es337930.sf/en_GB/?ObjectPath=/Shops/es337930/Products/DJ326N-PSI

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The name catgut is confusing. There are two explanations for the mix up.

Catgut is an abbreviation of the word cattle gut. Gut strings are made from sheep or goat intestines, in the past even from horse, mule or donkey intestines.

Otherwise it could be from the word kitgut or kitstring. Kit meant fiddle, not kitten.

I've been using the Schallers lately and am happy with them. I might try a set of Rubners just for grins and giggles.

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Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

Ah! Twelve bucks a set....I can process that. If they turn out to be aggravating, I can climb the price ladder, but it's going to cost me only twelve bucks to see if I want to.

Now for my ignorant question: Do I need (or should use) bushings, too?

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Peter Havriluk

The old guitars didn't use bushings and most of them are still working fine without them. I've never bothered with bushings but if you wanted to get high tech you could make some bushings out of lignum vitae, a dense, slippery wood or ebony.

I was thinking more along the lines of whether I need to budget four bucks for a set of bushings...

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Peter Havriluk

This is totally wild to me. Are we really talking about getting tuners for a hand made guitar for under $20? Maybe skip a few coffee runs, or fast food lunches and buy something you feel great about.