Official Luthiers Forum!

Looking great Steve!

I'm about ready to start on the neck reset but since I already pulled the frets I'm a bit concerned about getting the geometry correct. IIRC the neck is dead straight right now (it has the steel bar reinforcement), I'll double check it when I go back down to the shop later.

It's a pretty easy matter to adjust for the missing height of the frets but I'm wondering if it would be better if I put some of the frets back in? I saved them so it wouldn't be difficult.

Should I make an allowance for the fact that it wasn't under string tension when I checked it? This was because the bridge was pulling off the top so the strings were slacked.

The other thing I could do is to use some paper shims, stick the neck back on and string it up, then check it. This is my second neck reset with a dovetail so any thoughts from those of you who do a lot of neck resets?

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

Hey Buddy - I would leave the frets off it and you don't need them. When I would build new guitars I set the necks without frets making this one no different.

Different folks have different specs that they like to set necks to so you will likely get more than one answer here. For me I always set my necks to the exact bridge that I will be using located in the exact spot that it will be and already fitted to the top meaning not flat if the top is no longer flat. This becomes a constant and one variable has been eliminated.

With the neck straight or as straight as it is with no truss rod in this case I set for an angle where the straight edge just skims the very top of the bridge when it's properly located (and fitted). Some may view this as a tad over set, some under set, it works and has worked very well for me though. The bridge need not be glued on yet, just properly located.

When the neck is fretted I want the straight edge to be over the bridge by the height of the respective frets.

Make sense?

Thanks Hesh, that makes perfect sense. I rechecked the neck and it is within 0.010" of being dead flat from the nut to the 13th fret. The extension falls off a bit (i.e. hangs out of the way). I'll clean it up a bit with a levelling bar and it should be about perfect.

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

Cleated the crack. Here's the tool I use, just clothes hanger wire in a handle and sharpened to a point. I use a very small drop of CA on the point, stick it in the cleat and then put some HHG on the bottom of the cleat and glue it in. I use the sanding blocks to clean up in the box. The far cleat does not look like its down right. I'll check it out tomorrow and redo it if needed.

Edit: the far cleat pulled down nice and tight after the hide glue dried - I still might redo them but not right now (which means probably never - ha). I gotta get this guitar ready to go to Michigan.

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

Steve when you are at our place I'll show you a simple jig that I made for using rare earth magnets inside and outside the box to clamp and position cleats. It's been given a rather obscene name that I can't mention here by my shop mates but it works like a charm and relies on the top side magnet being properly positioned to draw the underside magnet and cleat with glue on it into the exact position. Cleats don't need much in the way of clamping and if you can get them to sit flat a rub joint is fine too. I use small magnets for this application so that when they "launch" inside the box out of the jig into the final position there is very little shock to the underside of the top. I'll show it to ya but you are sworn to silence under the cone of silence to not reveal the obscene name of the jig now written on the thing....

Really nice work on your Martin too - good going!

Thanks Hesh, I'm not even sure I want to know the name but I sure would like to see the jig I was trying to figure out a quick way to get a magnet on there so a jig would be nice. With my big arms I've realized I simply can't get very far into the box and have to rely on shop-made tools to get the work done.

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

Steve, you got vacuum?

David, I do have a vacuum pump and that's a good idea, I'll have to rig one of those up.

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

It's 3/16" OD Aluminum tubing so you can suck a magnet with a cleat on it. I have a foot switch on my pump but drilled a hole that I cover w/ my finger. As soon as you want release, uncover the hole and it dumps the vac.

Simple and effective. I like that. I like the diamond shape of your cleat better than my rotated squares too. I may have to take those out and redo them.

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

I finally got some time to get back to this one. Used a leveling bar to get the neck level (mostly) from nut to join. The Brazilian smells good.


Got the heel cleaned up and ready to trim.


Straight edge shows neck needs to come up 0.181" at the bridge which works out to 0.046" off of the heel.


I marked the heel to take off 0.040" and then will do the rest when I floss the heel. I mark the heel with my favorite scribing tool.


Then marked the lines with a knife


Out of time for today but the fit is pretty close. Should be able to finish it this week.

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

Got back to it tonight and I'm pretty stoked, got everything to fit and it looks pretty good! I finally figured out that the easiest way to post is to put in the photos in Tapatalk then edit on the laptop where it's easier to type (guess I'm just slow ).

Cleaned up the dovetail on the neck. There is some chipout on the dovetail but since the neck came out clean when I steamed it out this is the way it came from the factory.


Used a chisel mostly (watching John Arnold fit a neck was instructional and an inspiration), sanded some and checked a lot with the straight edge.


After all was said and done I flossed for final fit. Only took about 15 strokes on one side and 12 on the other. Used some thin cardboard shims - only needed about 0.015". Straight edge just kisses the top of the bridge.


Got the center line dead on. Whew!


Heel came out good. There is one gap for about 3/4" that is about 0.002" but I think a small brush and some lacquer will make it go away. I don't want to floss it any more because I'm afraid it will end up overset.


Next session I'll put on some 0.020" mahogany shims I have prepared and then fit them. The fretboard extension is up about 0.025" at the end and I'm wondering if I need to shim it or not?

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

Ya gotta love when it comes out right on center like that!

And it didn't have to move far after the initial cuts on the neck; I only had to floss a few extra strokes on one side to move it over maybe 3/16". Probably beginners luck. This is my second neck reset and this one has gone a LOT faster than the first one. I got the shims fit last night so need to make a wedge for the extension and then I can glue it back together.

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

Got the wedge made. Used the similar-triangle method discussed in a thread I started a few days ago. Had a bit of blow-out where the wedge gets paper thin but that won't be a problem. Hopefully I'll have time to glue it in tomorrow.



It came out two thousandths smaller than I wanted, I realized that is the depth of the plane blade below the bed. Its not a big deal but I will compensate for that next time and may also calculate the height of the fixed block so that I can leave a gap between block and the high end of the wedge. That would make it easier to plane. Otherwise the method works great, no way I could have cut a 0.051" to 0" wedge on a saw. Especially from Brazilian.

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

Nice work

Glued on the wedge. All ready to glue the neck.


Used my high-tech heat lamp setup to warm everything up while the HHG warmed up.


Glued it up, clamped it up, cleaned a little squeeze out and I'll come back tomorrow and check it.

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

Your over the hump! (so to speak)

Nice light boom too.

This reset went a lot smoother than my first one.

Amazing what one can do with a 2x2 and a deck screw

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

Unclamped the neck and everything looks good. Straight edge still just touches the bridge and centerline is still good. Fall away hit my target of 0.015" measured at the last fret. Learned a lot on this one. Next steps will be to address the cosmetic issues.

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

Started fixing the finish, both the areas where I made repairs and some of the dings I made over the years. I'm not expecting to make the repairs invisible but want them to blend in as well as I can. I'll try to build up the lacquer then level. Not sure on the best way to match the existing finish since it is not gloss.

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

I realized after brushing on some regular lacquer last night that trying to fill in the repairs with the regular thin lacquer would take forever. I remembered I had a jar of really thick lacquer left over when I sprayed and accidentally didn't empty the cup for a while. You can see on the side of the plastic cup it's pretty thick, kind of like cold molasses. I took some of that and thinned it a bit and that seemed to work much better at filling in the low spots.

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

Looking really good Steve, I like the precision you used to set the neck angle, I never actually measured anything when I do mine, I just shave it until it is close and then floss it to fine tune the rest in. Its probably not the "correct" way but it works for me...

If you want to dull down the places where you are filling with lacquer then get some Testors Dullcoat Lacquer at your local hobby shop. Just mix that in with your final coat and you can match the sheen almost perfectly. I have a bottle of it that I have had for years for just that purpose.

Looks like you are doing some really nice work on this one, it should turn out great.

Cheers,
Bob

Thanks Bob. I'm pretty happy with the results so far. I got the idea for the measurements from a StewMac video. I expect with experience you know how much to take off but being my second reset, the calculations saved me a ton of time.

I'm slowly getting the finish repairs where I want them but it's a slow process for me. Thanks for the lead on the Testors Dullcoat; I'll pick some up.

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"