Official Luthiers Forum!

Hi,

I have a Fender Squier that I am converting from Right to Left hand. It also has some bad dings and a couple cracks in it. When I was pulling the bridge off I thought I had cut deep enough around the bridge, but didn't and ended up pulling up some of the top layer. Top layer as in this is an el cheapo plywood guitar.

While I was doing the conversion I thought I would do is go ahead and change out the top wood and back wood as part of the conversion. Some cedar for the top and maybe some mahoghany for the back. Not high end wood by any stetch, just some wood to get it playing. I have never taken a top and back off before so this will be interesting.

My questions have to do with taking the top and back wood off of the guitar;

Is there a way to take the top off without taking the fret board all of the way off?

What is the best way to heat up the glued seams ? I have no idea what kind of glue was used on this build probably some type of yellow glue I would imagine. But it is so low end you never know.

I have a heat gun if that can be used.

I already bought my left hand saddle, nut, bridge, and Grover tuners. Just need to get some decent wood on the top and the back.

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Dean

EDIT: Sorry, I thought you were talking about an electric, I didn't realize it was an acoustic. Replacing the top and back is probably a bad idea.

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A man hears what he wants to hear, and disreguards the rest. Paul Simon

Pictures Please

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The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

I can't do pics at the moment, I have CitriStrip all over the sides. Which is going well by the way. That stuff works well.

My first attemp to repair as a newbie and uninformed luthier wanna be was to glue the cracks with super glue then where there were strips of the plywood missing around the bridge I used some natural color wood filler. I think that part went okay so far.

But after sanding in order to blend it all together the spruce top layer of the plywood is thinner than rice paper. It is actually starting to flake off in areas. Some of that is my fault for oversanding. Which is why I was thinking about pulling the top and back off and giving it a re-do.

_________________
Dean

I am afraid you are going to get in over your head in a hurry if you start removing top and back . NOT easy work . This based on your comment " first attempt" when you can post pics . You may be better off using a filler and Painting this guitar than anything else . But that is a "guess" based on no visual

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

While yes it is in depth work, I have all of the necessary tools to do it. I have wood working experience too.

I have just never separated the glue holding the top and back on. I hope to salvage as much of the original guitar as possible.

_________________
Dean

Ok good , based on your comment I wasn't sure . You have a good size job ahead , but it's doable . Look forward to seeing your work.

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

I just don't have Lutherie experience. I spent some money and bought a new Dremel 4000 kit with all of the accessories included because my two existing kits have seen better days and they are missing parts. Bought a StewMac Dremel Router Base to compliment my regular router and some 1/8" shank router bits of various types for the box. Also a couple Zona razor saws, a 14tpi and a 18tpi.

Of course I also have my Mill which will come in handy too at some point for something whether its making a new tool or cutting a funky groove. The only thing I have not invested in yet is clamps, molds, and templates... that kind of stuff. Of course I just have not gotten that far yet.

So what is the best way to break the glue seam without damaging the sides?

Also going back to a question I posed further up... Can the top be removed without taking the entire fret board off?

Regarding the pics... You can see that when the guitar was built there was a gap between the bridge and the top. For some reason they used 1/4" dowels to also secure the bridge to the top. I have already drilled them out.

Looking at the pic as it is... towards the sound hole the bridge was contacting the top under the frist layer of plywood. The bottom of the bridge, away from the sound hole, was sitting on top of the top layer of plywood. When removing the bridge the portions that were pulled up were the left side and the top towards the sound hole.

_________________
Dean

I use steam to remove the top . Bought a steamer off eBay for like 30.00. You can steam around the top joint and use a sharp knife to help separate the joint . If you go this route remove top and replace , then back and replace . As for the fret board , yes you can pull the fret at the body neck joint and use a thin saw to cut it at that fret then just remove the section on the top. However I will once again recommend filler and paint and lacquer. Much less work and the results can be excellent.

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

Okay thanks.

I am in the middle of stripping the sides. Once I get that finished I will see where I am on the whole thing. I do know I have at least one brace on the back that has come loose maybe two. I may just call it a day and finish up stripping the sides and neck then sand them. Finish up on the filler too. I have some nice oil stain I had custom mixed at home depot. I did a test stain and varnish that is out in the garage drying. I will bring it in and take a pic and post it here. That will be my top color. I have a dark mohogany color for the sides and back.

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Dean

Here is the test stain I did on some Spruce. I put five thin coats of lacquer on it after sealing the wood with Aqua Coat.

_________________
Dean

That does look good . I am very interested in this thread and will be watching all the way through.

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

might consider a new neck for this one while you're at it!

Actually before it was dropped several times and some unknown object hit the bridge while it was sitting on the stand, it was barely played. It was my sons. So the neck is actually like new, besides, I just want to get it repaired and playing again while at the same time learn a little about repairing guitars.

I have this one hanging on the wall and a Martin D-16GTL on layaway. The place I am getting the Martin from has more left hand inventory than anyone on the internet that I have ever seen. And, quite a nice right hand inventory too.

_________________
Dean

Just an update... I got the sides stripped and sanded. They are all plywoood too. I am not surprised, just providing an update. At this point I may just cut my time and expenses and finish stripping the neck. Then stain the sides, back and neck a dark mahogany and the top the color above... I guess you would call it vanilla??? Then lacquer it all. Here is the stain codes to get it mixed. Its Minwax stain.

_________________
Dean

I have a question regarding the bridge replacement on this guitar...

When I removed the factory bridge it had two 1/4" dowels in addition to the glue holding it onto the top. What I found is that the top layer of plywood had partially been removed in the same shape as the bridge but smaller. The front side of the bridge, towards the sound hole, was down on the second layer and the backside of the bridge, away from the sound hole, was sitting on top of the first layer.

Now when I re-glue the new bridge, should glue it the same way, or...

1... remove the top layer with my Dremel Router completely and glue the bridge down on the second layer again using the 1/4" dowels

2... Dremel Router down a little deeper and glue in a piece of spruce and sand it down level with the top level and again use the 1/4" dowels.

3... use one of the above options without the dowels.

???

_________________
Dean

Anyone ?

_________________
Dean