Official Luthiers Forum!

I thought I would start a build log over here so that some of you that may be on the fence about CNC can really see how easy and inexpensive this plan is to build. You can read about the plans at this site: http://www.joescnc.com. I know that Rick Hubka is also building one of these machines as well so he can chime in.

When you sign up for Joe's plans, you will get access to the private forum - there are over a hundred successful builds of this machine right now and more are added every day. I was a little intimidated at first, because I didn't really know that much about the CNC world, but after having been exposed to the plans and the forum, I can tell you that this is really simple, and really worthwhile. From a cost perspective, I will have a machine with a 58 X 48 cutting area, with a 4th axis for doing turnings, etc, and I will have about $2,300 into it when all is said and done...

A little about the machine I am building:

Rack and Pinion drives on X and Y axis, leadscrew on the Z
I'll be running a Gecko G540 Driver and 380 oz NEMA 23 motors on the X Y and Z axis
I"ll have a second BOB (Breakout Board) with a Gecko 203 and a 425 oz motor driving the Rotary Axis
Controller software will be Mach 3 - and yes, henny, I'll be looking for those luthier wizards when I'm done.

This is exciting stuff for me. The forum at the Joe's site is filled with really helpful and knowledgable people, and if you have a question about something, you can typically find that someone else has already asked it...much like this place!

Anyway - on with the build!

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Mitch

The BASE

On the Joe's CNC plans, we typically have free reign on how we want to implement our machine bases. I've seen some really elaborate cabinetry under some of the machines, while other's simply built some wooden tables. Right now, the "in" thing to do seems to be welding the bases out of tube steel. Well, I don't have a welder, and I have a unique set of requirements. Living in Florida, and not having a separate shop, I want my base to be mobile, and I want the machine to be able to fold up, so that if we do get a hurricane, I can reclaim some shop space and get the cars inside. This took a little creativity, but I found an example on the Joe's forum that someone did with steel, and I set about to do the same in wood.

This is a work in progress - I need to still add some bracing to the legs so that they are more solid, and some plywood on the top, but here is a blow by blow of the Hurricane Base...

First - the Pedestal


The offsets on the pedestal allow the table to swing straight up and down...


Here is the basic table frame - I should mention that all the joints here are done with my Festool Domino - Rock solid...


Here is the base so far, in CNC Mode...


And here it is in Hurricane Mode - I'll be finishing up the bracing, the deck, and painting it over the weekend...

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Mitch

The X, Y, and Z carriages

The plans you get from Joe contain very accurate drawings of these parts. For about $400, you can have Joe actually cut these parts for you on his own CNC. These are all MDF, and some HDPE pieces for the Z motor mount...

The parts fit together very well, almost don't need glue (but yes, they are glued). I will paint these next week...

X and Z


Y Carriages

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Mitch

Here's the Joe's CNC built by Joe himself, running a break-in wizard - Rapids at 1200 IPM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WwEkrQo6740&feature=player_embedded

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Mitch

Good luck to you on the build. It goes together pretty quickly once you have all the parts in house. The one thing I wish I would have done when building mine was spend more time getting the base absolutely level. I used a crappy level (that really wasn't) and have had to shim the machine where it mounts to the base.

Bob

BEST OF LUCK ON YOUR BUILD!!

Looks like you have an awesome start already. Joe's machine is one of the best one out there, and sure has a lot of folks who have build it, and have had great success with it.

I am sure yours will turn out to be great, and if we can be of any help, do not hesitate to ask...

I wonder: Why rack and pinion over lead screws? I am not looking to start a debate, just curious. Is it simplicity, or rapids?

_________________
-CyborgCNC
http://www.cncguitar.com
https://www.facebook.com/CncGuitar

I went with the rack and pinion for simplicity and also for the increased work area - in any given Joe's design, the R&P gives you 10-12" more travel in either direction.

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Mitch

I went with Joe's 4x4 R&P too.
Simplicity, Rapids, Larger work area.
My 3 rack pieces just arrived today.

There are almost 20 builders either starting with or converting to R&P on Joe's forum.
Several builders have finished the R&P builds and are all happy they went that route.
Joe announced today he will be updating his Web Site soon and offering both types of Plans and Kits.

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Rick Hubka
Chemainus BC Canada

Unless you can afford a ball-screw drive, rack & pinion offers better accuracy over typical screw drives.

Tell me plz, do you think joe's machine (MDF) offers enough rigidty for guitar building? I SO want a CBC machine!

Mike,

The beauty of a DIY machine based on a proven plan is that you can alter whatever you don't like. I have a Joe and I really like it. Right from the start I upgraded to hardened rails as opposed to the standard angle iron rails. I also went with the more expensive precision acme rods from McMaster. I tested my backlash and have .0005 on the X axis but something closer to .002 on the Y. Still for a DIY machine I'm really pleased. I thought the Z axis could be improved upon and came up with something cut out of aluminum (on my Joe machine). While I was at it I replaced the mdf x carriage with aluminum. Now when I chuck a 1/2" drill rod in my router and bury it into the table I get about .070 in deflection. Guess where almost all of it is coming from. The mdf X carriages? The X or Z? - Nope. It's coming from the 2"x4" 8020 aluminum X rail. So, that will probably be my next upgrade. Can you hog off material an inch at a time? No, but I think it's more than accurate and sturdy enough for guitar parts.

Here's a video of my new Z axis.



Bob

Thanks Bob. Could see your video. I look forward to learning more about your upgrades

My first machine, as you can see from the video below, was build from Home Depot parts....

-Used Oak for the base, and the gantry....
-Used Electrical conduit for the rails...
-Skate bearings and Aluminum angle...
-Regular "home depot" threaded rod...

Was it fast? NO!
Was it accurate? YES! (for wood)
Was it rigid enough for guitars and other similar parts? You bet!

So I guess my point is that even with MDF and very simple parts/items you can create a machine that will easily cut any wood
which you might use in guitar building. Not production speeds by any means...but accurate and precise non the less.

It allowed me to learn the CNC process with a VERY minimal investment....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z3-P606PO0U

_________________
-CyborgCNC
http://www.cncguitar.com
https://www.facebook.com/CncGuitar

Had a good day in they shop today...

finished bracing up the base...



Completed Base - Very solid



My buddy brought over his Harbor Freight metal cutting chop saw - made cutting the angle iron and unistrut really easy..

A little paint, and its Miller (Lite) time!

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Mitch

Looking good, you'll be hooking up the motors in no time. Nice to have mechanical help when cutting steel. I cut my unistrut with a hacksaw in the Home Depot parking lot. Amazing how many strange looks you get from the contractors.

Bob

Yes it is! I would have had an arm big as Popeye if I had to hacksaw all that steel. My buddy is a retired navy man and he went with me to Home Depot and Lowes to pick up what I needed. he gets a military discount and insisted on going along. When we finish this machine, he is gearing up to cut Pool Cues. I'm not the only one having fun with this build!

He got to pick the color for the base - battleship gray!

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Mitch

Mitch,
Great job on the router. I am also working on building a 4 axis router. I am using Gecko320's with 300 oz-in Nema 23 servo's. I am shooting for 600 ipm. I am using a combination of Timing belts and ball screws. I have the controls done but really need to get moving on the mechanical part. Your pics are inspiring me to get moving!

How fast do you think your rapids will turn out? Have you finished your controls?

Keep up the good work.

Brad

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Brad
Avon, OH

Hi Brad - Glad to be an inspiration!

Most of the rack and pinion builds on the Joe's design have rapids around 1200 IPM. Cutting speeds will be a lot less obviously...

I'm hoping to be in that ballpark. I just ordered my electronics - as listed in the first post - plus all my bolts, the 8020 extrusions, etc. All that stuff should be arriving here this week. I hope to have a running machine in early april...

Start a build log here so that folks can see how easy this really is to do and we can see how your machine is coming along!!

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Mitch

Sounds like you are moving along. I just need to get a few parts machined and should be able to put all my linear actuators together. Good idea about the build log....I might have to do that soon!

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Brad
Avon, OH

Here is a link to a previous thread about my build.

http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10106&t=22757

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Brad
Avon, OH

CyborgCNC - I saw your videos for Neck Design and Machining on your website - check Paypal...you have money!

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Mitch

What is the 4th axis in such a machine?

You really can't see it yet - but at one end of the table I will have an opening that contains essentially a lathe, and a vertical clamp. the lathe is the 4th axis, which will have a dedicated controller, driver, and motor for doing spindle type work. The vertical clamp is so that I can clamp boards in vertically and do other types of cuts, like dovetail joints, box joints, etc. - those don't require the 4th axis, but I can use the same opening in the table to do both...

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Mitch

Here's another update - not on the machine but on software and design - now I admit I am completely new to CAD/CAM and "how" you actually draw the parts that you want to cut on the machine. I was hoping to actually find some files that were already done so I wouldn't have to take on so much learning at one time.

Fortunately, for me, I found someone right here on this forum that can "teach me how to fish".

CyborgCNC has some videos on his site for how to draw and machine a guitar and another set that focuses on guitar necks, fretboards, and inlay. I received the videos this week and within an hour I had designed my very first fretboard, complete with inlay and a very nice compound radius.

These videos are very well done, extremely easy to follow, and I found myself learning the software very quickly, and understanding the various operations much more easily than I would have by fumbling around on my own.

I highly recommend if you are new to this, or even if you are a sesoned veteran, check out the videos! They just shortened my learning curve by months, if not years.

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Mitch

Anything new Mitch?

Not yet, sorry Chris - My day job suddenly turned into a day and NIGHT job and I've been out of town for most of July and up to last week. I'll be trying to get back to it soon...

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Mitch