Official Luthiers Forum!

OK...it's a bait and switch scheme since we apparantly don't have polling capability. On a previous post, there was some interest in having a separate section for electric build issues but the prevailing opinion at the time was that it should be included in the Main Discussion Forum.

Nonetheless, without the benefit of a poll, I am interested in knowing what the level of experience and talent that is available among the current members...as well as the prospect of attracting new members. The vast majority of us are here for the Acoustic Guitar building experience but I have lately taken a short break in order to complete 2 electrics that I started a few years ago. As such, the questions I have had along the way have been posted here as well as on an Electric Guitar-specific forum. Not surprisingly, the best answers were found elsewhere but I would love to have a one-stop shopping place here at the OLF should there be an interest and willingness to expand the OLF mission.

OK...so I'll go first and list my interest and experience:

Yes, JJ...great idea! I personally would like to see a separate section for electrics. I have built one Tele and one Strat-type guitar using pre made bodies and necks. These endeavors were mainly self-directed attempts at learning setup, learning electronics issues, selecting hardware and pickups, assembling and then finishing guitars in order to test my interest and curiosity. Currently, I am building 2 electrics totally from scratch and am enjoying the challenge and complexity as much as I do with acoustics. One model is a Les Paul Type while the other is a solid body that my son designed. Working with many of the different woods for both body and necks that we use on acoustics have led to new creative challenges which have so far been as enjoyable as any acoustic I have built. I plan to split my future building efforts to both acoustics as well as electrics and who knows where it may even crossover into some hybrid that was completely unplanned.

I'm looking forward to hearing about other experiences, interests and suggestions.

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JJ
Napa, CA
http://www.DonohueGuitars.com

I see no problem with it if enough people would participate. My ** ONLY ** reservation would be in starting a new area that gets virtually no traffic. Provided there is enough interest we will enthusiastically start a new discussion area...

Just give us a little time for the dust to settle on this move first.

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Brock Poling
Columbus, Ohio
http://www.polingguitars.com

My intent was in no way to rush this Brock. I would agree that the other sections that you established are rarely used and we don't need another one taking up space. I only wanted to start the discussion and let it lead where it may. If it garners little interest, then OLF will still be my home for acoustic guitars. Thanks for your consideration.

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JJ
Napa, CA
http://www.DonohueGuitars.com

I'm not particularly interested in an OLF electric section. I find it more appropriate to not divide interest groups into communities so small that they become ineffective. Nothing kills a forum like inactivity due to lack of a critical mass if interest. Having a stimulating level of activity will attract even more.

JJ, I am thinking of building electrics sometime in the future so I would be interested
in an electric section. I thick it would be enjoyable to design my own solid body
shape and neck all from scratch. I'm sure there are a lot of OLFers who build electrics so I say Lets do it!

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Anderson Guitars
Clearwater,Fl. 33755

O.k. I'm stupid...but why do we need a different forum? This is the "luthiers" forum. Don't luthiers make electric guitars also/too? Please don't get offended all you acoustic builders. I've seen lots of "other" things pop up in this forum...can't we all just get along?

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Dave Bland

remember...

"If it doesn't play in tune...it's just pretty wood"

To date, I have only built and completed electric guitars and basses. While obviously very different from acoustics there are many similarities in the instruments and building process. So much about being part of this community is about sharing growth, progress, and accomplishments across the boundaries of build style (and object of build). That is why strictly 6-string acoutic builder can appreciate the work and craftsmanship of a uke builder and so on and so forth. My vote would be to keep it integrated - but maybe that comes because I would be one of the few souls relocated to the new tab

Stephen

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www.ziegenfussguitars.com

I have been planning to try an electric guitar for almost a year now. Got the Hiscock book, been making a list of parts to buy. I even found some nice bookmatched claro walnut at Woodcraft this weekend that is big enough for a top.

I would love to hear what others in this forum are doing. I don't much care if it is in a separate section or not.

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53% of all statistics are made up on the spot
http://driftwoodguitars.blogspot.com/

I'll chime in with a vote after the dust settles from the software change. Right now the main page is totally cluttered, but it mostly seems to be software-related topics. That in addition the the slightly new look and layout really is making the whole page quite disorienting to me right now. We'll have to talk about it when things calm down a bit.

I do like to be able to sort by topic specific discussions. I think things like the CNC and Resonator discussions are small enough niches that I'm not surprised at the low traffic they get. Electric instruments and electronics certainly have wide enough interest, and though the current membership may show moderate enough interest to justify a new forum, I've often wondered if the lack of a specific electronics forum has kept the membership that way. People specializing in electrics, electronics, pickups, etc., I'm sure have poked their nose in here and not stuck around because of this. I think it would attract a new kind of member.

Todd brings up a very good point to consider about the new members it may attract. If you go to the forums that specialize more specifically on electrics, they can be generalized as a bit more raucous and have much more need of a moderator/babysitter at all times. I know it sounds like a terrible stereotyping, but judging by other forums it's something to at least consider.

I think I'd be for it, but more interested in a repair forum. Then again, those bring in everybody who wants to fix their guitar they just smashed, finds this site on google, won't bother to buy a book or even search archives, and just come up to ask the same questions that require extremely long answers time after time. I come here to trade info and tips with colleagues and enthusiasts, not answer the same dear Abby letters time after time.

Maybe in a month we should bring this up again.

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Eschew obfuscation, espouse elucidation.

I can see pros and cons both ways.

Most folk skip stuff in the Main Forum if it doesn't interest them. By the same token, they rarely visit specialty forum sub-divisions either. So well worded topics can save folks the drudgery of sorting through threads of no interest to them.

Recently I posted about Electric Guitars in the OFF Topic section. I'll have to say, there was enough banter to really help me work through ideas and misconceptions I had about my project. It was really helpful.

So basically we have a place for it already. When the OLF started back in 2004 it was all about Acoustic Guitars, matter of fact the name was Let's Talk Acoustic Guitars. Things change.

I personally want to be able to talk about a range of subjects, not just guitars. Many of you know what I'm saying, you get attached to a select few OLFers and they really do become cyber-friends. So what is happening in their lives, good and bad becomes life-giving and life-enriching and life-helping conversation. Seen it, like it, appreciate it.

So, whatever we do, give it some thought. My guess is that since most of us do acoustics, the electric section would be slow until it attracted more OLFers who, hey, primarily do electrics. May not be us, may be the new faces Todd alluded to?

Lately, there are so many new folks on the OLF, I kind of feel like an outsider. Look around, stuff like facebook, myspace, and other networking sites serve to connect people and their interests. No reason the OLF can't grow into a one stop luthier's paradise. Imagine CelloWorld, or ViolinsRus, or ElectricGuitarz, Anthingw/Strings, etc etc.....

I am involved in building electric guitars and would be glad to follow traffic either in the main forum or in a separate forum. I am not against subdividing the forums - sometimes this makes following a certain topic easier (as on MIMF).

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Jim Kirby
kirby@udel.edu

Is that avatar is a shark bite? Or is that a hoax....

That would ruin your day...

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Brock Poling
Columbus, Ohio
http://www.polingguitars.com

I don't know either, but it is GROSS!

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Waddy

Photobucket Build Album Library

Sound Clips of most of my guitars

Hi JJ, I would definitely visit an electric section, after all, there are many areas that overlap like finishing methods, schedules, binding, routing, scarf joints, fretting, jig building, etc. I haven't built an electric yet but in the last year I've totally restored from the graveyard a 1966 Rickenbacker 360 and a 1965 Gibson EB-2. I'd be game for an electric section, especially when it comes to the electronic portions like winding pickups, etc.

Cheers!

John

I have only built one guitar so far - a single cut LP Special, but I am interested in all things guitar related & would prefer that it all be kept in one forum. I hate having to jump around & as someone else mentioned, if there is a separate forum with very little traffic then odds are questions will go unanswered for long periods of time.

Dave

Great idea JJ! I too would welcome an electric section... I haven't tackled one yet, but it's on the 'to do' list for sure!

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I'd like to be able to prove, just for once, that money wouldn't make me happy...

I started out building electrics and only started acoustics 10 years ago.
To me, the two are so integrated into a same camp that I think a separate place may take away from all things learned from electrics that can be applied to acoustic builds.
I can understand the purist both in players and builders that strive for the best acoustic tone, but at the same time, the problem of playing with others especially on stage, is not going away and there is always going to be the search for how to amplify. Although a solid body electric is at the end of the spectrum, it is still an important contributor to how guitars work.
I suppose electrics are worthy of their own discussion place but I hope that would not mean the acoustic folks will miss out on the benefits of electric know-how.


Wade

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Wade
Nashua, NH
http://www.wadefx.com

I'm still mostly an electric builder (I feel more confident/comfortable building electrics, it's a bit less challenging because of the experience I've got), but I'm not entirely sure the net really needs another electric building forum. We've got an active (and strictly moderated) area over at the MIMF. We've got the free-for-all (largely because, well, about 60% of newbies coming into electric guitar building seem to be teenagers who want to build a FRIGGIN' AWESOME ROCK MACHINE DUDE! RAAAWWK!!!) of Project Guitar, tempered by plenty of knowledgable folks building fantastic instruments (including some who hang around here, too...). I can't say I really agree with Todd when he says it's particularly vicious over there; sure, some folks have a slightly short fuse if folks come in, ask a question google, or reading a few pinned topics, or spending 10 minutes reading tutorials on the main site, or even doing a really basic search could've answered. And I understand them. Heck, often enough, I'm one of them (although I'll chew them out and answer the question anyway, half the time), because to me, that's just a sign of rudeness. Project Guitar, f'r instance, has an acoustic section as well, but frankly, there are only a small handful of topics there, and while it's good because it exposes a big group of electric builders to acoustic construction, it hardly registers compared to the electric stuff.

I suspect much the same would happen here; those of us who build electrics mostly have places we go to discuss them, and nobody minds someone posting a picture, description, whatever of a newly completed guitar, electric, acoustic, classical, archtop, doubleneck, bouzouki, mandolin, whatever. Questions are always welcomed, and answered quite extensively, I've found. But whether an entire new section is useful, or even desirable....

I'm on the fence on this one.

I vote for an electric section, since the posts will get pushed to the archives quicker if posted in the acoustic section. I usually browse through the posts in each section based on most recent post, and I'd rather not jump back and forth between electric and acoustic building techniques in the same section.

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John S.

It doesn't matter to me either way, but one thing I think is very very important is the title of a thread.

I think it's more important to title one's thread appropriote to the issue/question at hand. That way you'll get those who can/want to help attracted to your thread.

So what ever is decided about separate forums for different disciplines is fine by me, just make sure the thread title is descriptive enough

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My Facebook Guitar Page

"There's really no wrong way, as long as the results are what's desired." Charles Fox

"We have to constantly remind ourselves what we're doing....No Luthier is putting a man on the moon!" Harry Fleishman

"Generosity is always different in the eye of the person who didn't receive anything, but who wanted some." Waddy Thomson

All for it JJ. I agree with some who think that luthiers also do electric's and other stringed instruments. I do dulcimers also, and would like to get into repair of other things than just acoustic guitars.

This is a very interesting thread. I'm a total amateur who has only made one classic and one dreadnaught copy, and that was 37 years ago. I fell in love with the guitar in 1955 or 56. No, it wasn't Bill Haley, it was Lonnie Donegan. An Englishman who recorded Leadbelly's 'Rock Island Line' and 'John Henry' and went to No.10 in the US charts).

When I started making (stringed) instruments again, about 6 or 7 years ago, I made an electric bass. Why? Because I'd started playing bass in our little ceilidh/barndance/whateveryoucallit band (I realised years ago that I would never be a guitarist) and thought "I could make one of these"! So, with the help of Melvyn Hiscock's book, I did. When I'd nearly finished it I discovered the Internet and the MIMF. I've made 2 more since then and nearly finished No.4. and they're all different.

When I've had problems or needed information I've always gone to the MIMF. There are just as many subjects under discussion in the 'electric' section as there are in the 'acoustic' one and the library of archived discussions is vast. But the process of archiving discussions there has ground to a halt, so you can't see any of the instruments I've made.

Although I've lurked around this forum for quite some time I've never thought of posting pictures of what I've made. You see, although it's called the 'Official' Luthiers Forum, (that put me off it for a start. Does that mean that all the others are 'UN-official'?), people calling in and having a look around soon get the impression that it's the Official-Steel-String-Guitar-Makers'-forum-where-classic-makers-are-tolerated. What's a luthier anyway? It's a guy who make lutes. Haven't seen many of them around here. Sorry, I digress. In fact, the reason I haven't posted anything I've made is not because I thought I might be scorned or criticised. Worse than that, I thought I might be ignored. When that happens you get the impression that everyone is saying "go away and play somewhere else".

One or two people have said they would be more interested in a section on instrument repair. What they mean I think is acoustic instrument repair. That's fair enough, because that's what interests them but that's not going to attract people interested in solid body electric guitars (and basses). Create a section for electric guitars and basses and I'm sure a lot more people will come along and subscribe to the OLF. I might even be tempted to show something I've made!

Well we certainly have the bandwidth now to broaden our horizons so I am all for it too.

I recently had the sincere pleasure of seeing two of Brock's electric creations and they both blew my mind. I had no idea the level of excellence that some builders are achieving these days.

Great idea JJ!!! (Where is the stinkin clapping hands emoticon (please )) (notice the nested loop.....)

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Hesh
Ann Arbor, MI USA
http://www.heshtone.com

aww shucks.

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Brock Poling
Columbus, Ohio
http://www.polingguitars.com

Actually, that's not so for myself, and am certain the vast majority of repair folk here would say the same. I specialize pretty much in everything fretted or plucked - electric, acoustic, guitar, bass, banjo, mandolin, ukulele, resonator - there are plenty of others, but these are what is constantly flowing through my shop. The acoustic six string guitar may constitute up to a third of my overall business, but I work on plenty of everything else and I know that most of the other repair folk here do as well.

As to the amount of classical builders participating here, there are few, but I think it's just a matter of statistics. I imagine that for every one classical made in the world there has to be around a hundred steel strings. Following the relative popularity in the lower single digit percentage, the amount of classicals seen here probably reflect general trends fairly well. Electrics certainly don't, but I think this may be a "chicken or the egg" situation. Is there no electric oriented forum here because it's not discussed enough to warrant one, or is it discussed so little because there's not a forum with a more electric atmosphere? Both, I would guess.

And a luthier isn't a guy who makes lutes - I think a girl making violins or ukuleles would fit the definition just as well.



This laughing emoticon by the way, looks a bit nervous or scared if you ask me.

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Eschew obfuscation, espouse elucidation.