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Terry Stowell

Post subject:

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 2:49 am

Koa

Joined: Thu Feb 24, 2005 4:53 am
Posts: 1584
Location: PA, United States

Hi all,

Need to finish a gtr quickly. I'm experienced with HVLP and compressor guns, have shot a couple hundred coats of nitro, and a few dozen of ktm-9. Not crazy about KTM-9. I'm working in my basement, so vapors are an issue. I made my own French polish years ago, & I know I can do it in house quickly, just not informed or confident enough to experiment on my brother's gift guitar.

So question is, are the pre-packaged French polishes good, like Qualisole, etc?

JJ, and others, whatta ya say?

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SteveCourtright

Post subject:

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 2:59 am

Koa

Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2006 6:17 am
Posts: 1937
Location: Evanston, IL
First name: Steve
Last Name: Courtright
Focus: Build
Status: Amateur

Zinsser Bullseye SealCoat Universal Sanding Sealer is a 2# wax free shellac. I and others have used it with very good results. You can get it at any hardware store like Lowe's, &c.

_________________
"Building guitars looks hard, but it's actually much harder than it looks." Tom Buck

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JJ Donohue

Post subject:

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 3:00 am

Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Mon Dec 27, 2004 3:50 pm
Posts: 4662
Location: Napa, CA

Consider the Zinnser dewaxed sanding sealed @ 1# cut. I've used it on 4 guitars and worked fine. I would recommend that you do this over 3 or 4 days to allow some hardening between sessions. Piece of cake!

_________________
JJ
Napa, CA
http://www.DonohueGuitars.com

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Colin S

Post subject:

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 3:20 am

Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Thu Jan 06, 2005 7:29 am
Posts: 3840
Location: England

I've French polished a whole bunch of guitars in the past, always making my own polish. The last half dozen I've used the Liberon Special Pale French Polish, pre mixed. It too is a dewaxed, virtually clear polish. You won't find me going back to mixing my own, this stuff is superb.

Colin

_________________
I don't believe in anything, I simply make use of a set of reasonable working hypotheses.

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sbrunker

Post subject:

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 3:48 am

Mahogany

Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2007 7:37 am
Posts: 46
Location: United States

Steve/JJ, are you guys spraying or FP'ing?

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Stuart Brunker

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Terry Stowell

Post subject:

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 4:21 am

Koa

Joined: Thu Feb 24, 2005 4:53 am
Posts: 1584
Location: PA, United States

I guess a pint would beenough for a guitar? I also think maybe I oughta F.P. the headstock before I drill tuner holes, etc. Any other supplies, product, or procedure pointers?

(Sorry I don't have time to wade through the volumes of threads (mis) labeled about French polish) I figure the learning curve is shorter than waiting for lacquer cure time. This guitar needs to be finished & set up by 12/22. I just glued the back to the rims. The neck/fingerbd are CNC'd and a quickie. Should be able to deliver on time...

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JJ Donohue

Post subject:

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 4:46 am

Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Mon Dec 27, 2004 3:50 pm
Posts: 4662
Location: Napa, CA

Stuart...FP...not sprayed.

Terry...Sorry, but I'm out of town and don't have time to re-type everything I've ever posted on FP. My advice...look it up. Pay particular attention to Michael P's. posts as well as Colin's.

_________________
JJ
Napa, CA
http://www.DonohueGuitars.com

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Howard Klepper

Post subject:

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 5:49 am

Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 6:16 am
Posts: 2692

So you think everyone has been mistaken about the difficulties of French Polishing, and that it has a shorter learning curve than the time it takes lacquer to cure?

Your brother is going to get a rush job. You really think the guitar won't reflect that? I suggest you revisit the premise that you have to have this guitar finished and set up in a month.

_________________
Howard Klepper
http://www.klepperguitars.com

When all else fails, clean the shop.

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SteveCourtright

Post subject:

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 6:14 am

Koa

Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2006 6:17 am
Posts: 1937
Location: Evanston, IL
First name: Steve
Last Name: Courtright
Focus: Build
Status: Amateur

I do FP. Terry, if you have experience with the FP technique, it sounds like the way to go under your constraints. Howard's point is a valid one if you have never done French Polish. Without the feel you develop with experience, it's hard to get right.

_________________
"Building guitars looks hard, but it's actually much harder than it looks." Tom Buck

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Kevin Gallagher

Post subject:

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 7:48 am

Koa

Joined: Wed Mar 16, 2005 2:30 pm
Posts: 1041
Location: United States

Todd,

   Not enough time for lacquer and I'd avoid the KTM-9 thing at all costs.
It's still got that weird water based blueness to it...not matter what
anybody says.

   I would suggest that you order some catalyzed polyester products from
McFadden's and shoot the finish. You can get a great finish in a few days
with steady work spraying, sanding and buffing. You could save you
shipping time and spend the HAZMAT and shipping cost on gas to run
into Philly to pick it up, too. Give them a call and make arrangements to
be there the next morning to get and they'll take care of you.

It will be more durable than the French polish and will be more like what
your brother will probably expect the guitar to be finished with.

   I love French polish and have done loads of medium to large fine
furniture pieces with it, but have never used it on a single guitar....just
because it never suited my tastes as a guitar finish.

   I do know, though, that to get the French polish application down to
where it provides even a decent apprentice quality appearance, you'd
better have a pretty long list of pieces under your belt with it.

   It is a very difficult process to master....and by that I mean be able to
apply a master grade finish that is worthy of the piece it is covering.

   I wish I had the material here to spray the guitar with the UV poly for
you. I'm out and am waiting for some income to be able to restock my
spray room. That's just where I am since recently returning to the shop.
There's a bottleneck at my spray booth right now that's growing every.

Regards,
Kevin Gallagher/Omega Guitars

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James W B

Post subject:

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 8:11 am

Koa

Joined: Sat Jul 01, 2006 5:55 am
Posts: 1392
Location: United States
First name: James
Last Name: Bolan
City: Nashville
State: Tennessee
Country: USA

I`ve also wondered about spraying shellac.It says on the Zinnser can it can be sprayed.It seems to me about 10 to 12 coats could be sprayed on rather quickly,and would eliminate any witness lines from rubbing.Has anyone tried this compared to the traditional FP?
It might be worth a shot Terry.It would sure emphasize the quality of the sound.
James

_________________
James W Bolan
Nashville Tennessee

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Terry Stowell

Post subject:

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 8:44 am

Koa

Joined: Thu Feb 24, 2005 4:53 am
Posts: 1584
Location: PA, United States

I know a guy that as a pro spray booth, but don't know yet if it's available. I have done very little FP years ago, so I'm not crazy bout it. Don't like KTM-9. Outgassing can't be done in my basement. Period. The alternative is deliver it when done!

I haven't tried the pre-cat yet. If I can spray it in a couple days, what's the outgassing/cure rub-out schedule like? I have micro mesh papers and a buffing arbor set up (Stew mac deal)

KEVIN, perhaps I can give you a call? Let me know...

Thanks guys. I'm really not willing to compromise on the finish quality. I am willing to compromise on the delivery.

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