Official Luthiers Forum!

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The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

That git needs a doctor! Hurry!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Reset time! I've learned to sing the song "Closing Time" substituting the words "reset time" and it looks like this may be your favorite song for a spell too.

Can't remember for sure on the DMs but I think that they have that single bolt glued mortice and tenon joint. Hopefully the glue joint has already failed but if not some steaming is in your future. I think that these have a wooden plate over the neck block covering the bolt too. The plate is only held on with double stick and a very small spatula works great to loosen the plate.

We have a special tool for these Martins that Dave also invented. That Dave guy sure gets around I tell ya.... Anyway it's brilliant and especially engineered to steam the necks off Martins with this specific neck joint.

When you get to this point Wud give me a call at Ann Arbor Guitars and I will be happy to tell you how to make your own with about 99 cents of hardware likely from your own store.

Lots of bracing may be loose too from your excellent pics. If you have an IPhone you can shoot video in the box for later display when your comfortable and with a beer. Pushing in and out of the top with one hand as you position the camera with the other hand can help to reveal the extent of the loose bracing.

I have to hand it to you too Jim and this is as sincere as a heart attack. You've gone a different route then most here seeking out these basket cases and then carefully and lovingly restoring them to playability and doing some really great work too I will add.

You will know far about how guitars fail as a result and as such likely will be able to put this to good use building too.

Good going my friend!

Thank you Hesh . I do enjoy the restoration probably as much as the. Building. It helps to see what the big boys so to speak have done . Using that as a base I think helps to have a better overall sense of direction. I'm still building , however as a retirement prospect , building a bit of a reputation as a restorer can't hurt . I will be in touch on this one , advice will be welcome !

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

Hey Wud, that one looks like it's a real mess. A fair amount of work to do there!

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

Looking forward to this one, Wud! If Humpty Dumpty were a guitar, he'd be still strumming tunes if you'd got a shot at him!

Alex

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"Indecision is the key to flexibility" .... Bumper sticker

Well I got the neck steamed off , I think I may have gotten one of the few in the USA that had a good glue joint . All on all about 15 min ... I know Hesh , I know .. You suggested NOT removing the top . But there is too much damage for my talents to work through the sound hole thus far . sooooooooooooooo off she comes . Will post pics shortly

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

You're the boss, Wud - what ever you think it takes is likely a good call!

My hats still off to ya for learning repair and restoration - good on ya my friend!!!

Steamed off the top as well , little to advanced for my talent to work through the sound hole yet . I will get there . I steamed a little at the tail block and the got the spatula under there and that sucker peeled off like unzipping a zipper . Almost no steam needed . Allot of work to repair it though

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

It's easy once you have the top off - problem I've found is getting the top back on is NOT easy. This repair/restoration stuff is interesting and I like but it sure can be a challenge sometimes and nothing at all like building a new guitar. Of course, I know you'll get 'er done Wud

Last top I put on with HHG - got it about 90% glued but had some humps where I didn't quite make it in time before the glue started gelling. I just steamed it and it popped right down.

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

I am cutting out a template that is the size of the guitar shape lining it with a very thin foam to avoid scratches and slide it over the sides before resetting the top .... at least thats the plan lol

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

Looking at Martin Replacement Bracing here ... The braces at one time were convex , now they are approx 3/16" concave .... i dont know if its from being damaged so long or what , but i cant see trying to reuse them and having further issues down the road

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

That's the problem I keep running into but I think you're on the right track. Me, I take it apart thinking "I'll just fix this and that little thing and get it back together" but as soon as I get em apart then I find all this other stuff I feel like I just need to do.

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

Looks like that top tried I get up and leave without it's bracing. Never leave the house without your bracing a kids!

Keep us updated.

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久保
美智え

The top on the Martin has "potato chipped" . I have new bracing and am ready to re glue the braces. Wondering if putting the top in a dish and steaming it. Lettingit set in place will help take out all the warping and potato chip effect. Thoughts ?

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

Pics please Wud?

Some warpage should not be an issue and the bracing should pull it back into the desired shape, after all, that's why we call it bracing....

That aside I have to ask is the potato (had to remember how to spell potato....) chipping a RH issue? Here in balmy Michigan the high today was 3F.... so RH is obviously on my mind. Anyway if RH is at all responsible for the warpage get that settled down first before bracing.

Not sure how thick this top is. Some tops can be whimpy as well even if they are thick and I'm bringing this up again thinking that bracing may pull everything back to where you want it.

I've had a top or two that had a slight radius all on it's own (as if I had nothing to do with it.... ) but fortunately the rosette side was out so I braced on and everything worked out.

Anyway it depends on how much potato chipping you are seeing so again a pic would be helpful.

Thanks!

I believe the bracing would pull it back at least 95% or so , I just wondered about the continual stress . Maybe over thinking this a bit . Basically it appears that when this got damaged it stayed in that condition a long time . Now the top is basically 25' radius the wrong direction .

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

Wud,

I'm by no means an expert on this so take what I'm saying as well.... however you want to take it.

I had a back plate that was doing some serious potato chipping. Due to an unfortunate incident with a lose belt on a drum sander the chipping went the opposite direction I had wanted it to go before I braced it. The drum sander had pretty much told me which side needed to be on the inside.

I asked some of my knowledgeable friends what they would do and they all said to brace it up and glue it on. Once the bracing was on, it held the plate in position. After gluing it to the rim I haven't seen any evidence of the potato chipping returning.

There is one successful Pringle story of bracing it and letting go. I hope yours works out as easy. Believe me I was doing my best to overcomplicate this before I was told to stop worrying about it and just build it.

Good luck on repairing this Martin. I have and abused one I'm working on now. It has taken me forever, but I'm learning a bunch and I think its going to be sweet when its done.

John

I'm beginning to think that's what I need to do as well . Thanks for the Input guys

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

Well I am Replacing The Martin Bracing and it does appear that I was Over thinking the Issue . It seems to be coming into place Nicely . I did cleat the two main cracks with a strip and then notch the brace over them . Not sure it was best approach . We shall see .

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

Nice work Wud!!!

PS: I have Ibex clamp envy too....

Luv those clamps , Use them ALLOT

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

Yeah we like em too and need more. Do you know about the trick that you can do with these where you pop off the white plastic thing leaving the ball end and then drill a slight divot in your bridge clamping caul to match the ball end for clamping bridges?

I DO NOW ! Great Idea

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/