Official Luthiers Forum!

I wish someone could give us the final word or proper procedure
to bring guitars with both BRW and or mahogany components to the show.
I know that it is best not to sell them in Canada, but rather just take them for the show period. IF this is indeed the case, that they are NOT FOR SALE does this change the restrictions to bring them across the border?

I really need some guidance in this issue.

Where is that GuitarJunky fella ! Bet he knows!

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Lance@LuthiersForum.com

Guitarjunky fellow here!

As serious organization we will of course tell you to respect the law. Brazilian cannot be brought through borders in most countries.

If you want to investigate more I will give you these links where you will find info

http://www.fws.gov/permits/faqs/FaqFGH.shtml
http://www.bluegrasswales.org/CITES.htm
http://www.kew.org/conservation/CITES_User_Guides/CITESPlants/EnglishCITESPlantsPack.pdf
http://www.acousticguitar.com/issues/ag114/QandA114.html
http://www.cites.org/index.html

Thanks!

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Jacques-André Dupont
http://www.guitarjunky.ca
http://www.montrealguitarshow.com

Thank Jacques, I suspected that is what the answer would be.
What I don't understand is where does this leave all the
traveling musicians world wide? If the "instrument" is not for sale, I don't understand how it would matter. What about all the pernambuco bows for violinists? There must be countless instruments made of brazilian rosewood.

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Lance@LuthiersForum.com

You can bring the wood if it is proven to be pre-banned era...

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Jacques-André Dupont
http://www.guitarjunky.ca
http://www.montrealguitarshow.com

guitarjunky wrote:
"You can bring the wood if it is proven to be pre-banned era..."

The operative word is 'proved'. I bought the BRW in my stash before there was a CITES treaty, and nobody thought of paperwork. The stuff was 'old' then, but I have no way to prove when I bought it.

My understanding is that there was an effort to mitigate the problems with pernambuco bows. The idea was to have a certificate of age that went with the bow. Presumably it would include pictures and other documentation so that the bow could be matched up. This would allow you to take it across the border of any country that had signed on to that system. You'd only get into trouble if you tried to cross with a bow and no certificate, or if the bow you had didn't match, as this would be evidence that you might have sold the bow.

That, after all, was the intent of the law: to elimimnate trade in endagered species. As it sits, there is a presumtion of guilt, and that bugs me. I can't take my prettiest guitar to the show!

Me either Al.

I wonder, what about necks and blocks etc made of Mahogany. All of my stuff is african mahogany, but I really
have no way to "prove" it?

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Lance@LuthiersForum.com

This CITES thing is going to become a lutherie nightmare. People advise beginners to start off with a cheap set of mahogany back and sides from Stewmac or LMII. That's OK for you guys in the good ol' US of A, but what about us poor buggers on the outside? Honduran mahogany is about as common, in France, as rocking horse manure.

Have any of you got CITES certificates to say when you bought your Honduran mahogany. Will Customs be able to tell the difference? If everyone tells them it's African will it be up to them to prove otherwise?

On the other hand, LMII says this:
"Honduran Mahogany is a traditional choice for necks, braces, heel blocks and end blocks. Although we can ship pre-carved necks anywhere, we cannot re-export unworked instrument grade Honduran Mahogany lumber." Which means you should be able to take an instrument incorporating 'worked' mahogany across borders. Or perhaps not. What a can of worms.

Us,canucks, also experience the same problems going into the US. I have been declaring for years now that my guitars are cocobolo and they are for display purposes only (with the proper paperwork.) Remember that once you have gone through the canadian customs you are not going to come back through them, you are going directly to the US customs and they do not have a clue of what you brought in. I always let the guitar go at the end of the show and never experienced any problems.If you end up selling to a US citizen then it is a lot less complicated to bring it back and then ship within the US.So bottom line is ,do not declare it as BRW.Do not list any material and just list it as an acoustic guitar.IF they ask you any questions just answer THE question and yes or no. Remember .....COCOBOLO!

Tommy Chong says if you enjoy cavity searches travel with a guitar..............

mcb1
What is "proper paper work" for a cocobolo guitar?

Thanks for your help.

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Lance@LuthiersForum.com

The paperwork I am refering to is to declare that the guitar will be returning to the country of origin and will not be sold in the visitng country.
it is just for registration of the goods.The form for the US is different so let me find out for Canada and will get back to you.

Thanks Mario for sharing this!

The paper you are refering is one that we can supply. Guys, you can contact Rebecca in my office and she will supply the form.

thanks!

_________________
Jacques-André Dupont
http://www.guitarjunky.ca
http://www.montrealguitarshow.com