Official Luthiers Forum!

Hey fellers, does "DOT' really stand for dot inlay type?
Man, I thought "SG" was lame.

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wah
Wah-wah-wah-wah
Wah

In the words of Grumpy......"sigh"

Anthony. I will have to look that info up and get back to you. As for springback it depends on the thickness of your layers and how they are oriented. A couple mm is usually fine.

I am not sure about the contours on that plan.


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Ken

_________________
Ken

Hi Ken, thank you and it would be much appreciated. (For the record, the "sigh" wasn't directed at you).

I know that you are vacuum molding a 3/16" laminate (using 3 x 1/16" veneer). I am worried about spring back so I plan on vacuum molding a 5-ply thickness of 5/32" (0.158) using (1/42" maple, 3 x 1/42" poplar, 1/16" figured maple).

From your gearpage thread, I noted that you are interested in the Curtate Cycloid. I modeled Curtate Cycloid arches from tail to neck with the tailpiece as the Apex and they didn't match the tail to neck side body profile arching in Pat Sharkey's plans. I did compensate for the 1.63" fretboard/body overhang.

The long arch is not a cc. Nor is it ever imo.
Especially with the fingerboard area being essentially a flat slope.
I will search for the numbers.


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Ken

_________________
Ken

I always balance my veneers. I guess i am paranoid about that old woodworking rule.

Maple-maple core crosswise 2 sheets-maple.

Skins are 1/20
Core are 1/32


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Ken

_________________
Ken

As for your laminates are you saying you use a 4-ply of 0.1625" using - 1/20" maple skin/2 x 1/32" maple core/1/20" maple skin?

I'll wait for your response to the above and stop peppering you with posts in the interim. I really appreciate your help.

Yes correct. However. My plates come out at 0.19 inch consistently. I guess my skins are more like 1/16. It doesnt matter much the exact thickness.

Modern gibsons benedetto heritage use the same skins but have basswood core. It is one thick crosswise sheet. I have some but have only used it once.


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Ken

_________________
Ken

We see what is known in the biz as "lawsuit guitars" often in our shop and although not exclusive to Gibson so-called designs Gibson has been the most aggressive in policing their IP. Combined with a CEO crybaby that thinks everything is always about him... As well as a penchant for feeling singled out as evidenced by Henry's op-ed piece in the WSJ after getting busted for poaching... if one sells their wares differentiation from Henry's products is not only prudent but a wise move.

Absolutely stunning instrument Ken!!! Very we'll done!

True. I can testify to that Hesh. My legal fees will also corroborate. He he
Thanks!



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Ken

_________________
Ken

Hi ya Ken! Dave and I were just talking about you (all good) last week and he knows you. I have yet to have the pleasure of meeting you so here is a standing invitation when ever you are headed south to come visit us at Ann Arbor Guitars!

By the way I was born in Traverse City. Remember the old mental hospital (seriously folks there was a state metal hospital in TS) I was born "on" the grounds and not "in" the grounds, there is a difference, my Dad worked there and was a psychiatrist. My childhood experiences first in Traverse City and later in Coldwater where there was also a state mental hospital made me ideally suited for the world of business and Lutherie....

By the way I have followed your beautiful work for about a decade now and if I am ever in the market for a 335 style instrument you will be my first and last stop!

Thanks for the invite, I will be taking you up sometime in the future. I get down there now and then. My mother in law lives in nearby.
As for the State Hospital, that is fascinating! It is a remarkable site and was a beautiful place for the mentally ill. You should see it now, all getting renovated. Building 50 is a hotspot in TC now. Restaurants, shops, bowtik coffee, all the cool stuff.

_________________
Ken

Here is the long arch.
The max height is about 11 mm.
With this data you can recreate it pretty well.
Here are the x y z coordinates. They should be good enough to get as close as possible. Space delimited.
Lets keep this beteen us luthiers here. Thanks. Of course it is public, but burried pretty deep here among friends.
0.5 0 0
1 0 0
1.5 0 0
2 0 0
2.5 0 0
3 0 0
3.5 0 0
4 0 0
4.5 0 0.9
5 0 1
5.5 0 0
6 0 0
6.5 0 0
7 0 0
7.5 0 0
8 0 0
8.5 0 0
0.5 0.5 0
1 0.5 0
1.5 0.5 0
2 0.5 0
2.5 0.5 0
3 0.5 0
3.5 0.5 0
4 0.5 0.73
4.5 0.5 1.64
5 0.5 0.96
5.5 0.5 0.35
6 0.5 0
6.5 0.5 0
7 0.5 0
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8 0.5 0
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1 1 0
1.5 1 0
2 1 0
2.5 1 0
3 1 0
3.5 1 0.34
4 1 1.43
4.5 1 2.8
5 1 2.18
5.5 1 0.73
6 1 0
6.5 1 0
7 1 0
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8 1 0
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0.5 1.5 0.5
1 1.5 0.5
1.5 1.5 0.25
2 1.5 0.53
2.5 1.5 0.1
3 1.5 0.4
3.5 1.5 0.8
4 1.5 1
4.5 1.5 3.2
5 1.5 1
5.5 1.5 0.5
6 1.5 0
6.5 1.5 0
7 1.5 0
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8 1.5 0
8.5 1.5 0
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1 2 1.6
1.5 2 1.3
2 2 0.91
2.5 2 1.21
3 2 1.28
3.5 2 2.22
4 2 3.1
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5 2 0.99
5.5 2 0.23
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2 2.5 2.2
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3 2.5 2.6
3.5 2.5 3.2
4 2.5 3.6
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5 2.5 0.64
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8 2.5 0
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2 3 3.4
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3 3 3.6
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2 3.5 4.5
2.5 3.5 4.4
3 3.5 4.2
3.5 3.5 3.76
4 3.5 2.3
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7 3.5 0
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8 3.5 0
8.5 3.5 0
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1 4 5.3
1.5 4 5.24
2 4 5.34
2.5 4 5
3 4 4.6
3.5 4 3.8
4 4 2.1
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5 4 0
5.5 4 0
6 4 0
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7 4 0
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8 4 0
8.5 4 0
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1 4.5 6.1
1.5 4.5 6
2 4.5 5.8
2.5 4.5 5.4
3 4.5 4.4
3.5 4.5 3.3
4 4.5 1.6
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7 4.5 0
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8 4.5 0
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1.5 5 7.1
2 5 6.5
2.5 5 6.4
3 5 4.8
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6 5 0
6.5 5 0
7 5 0
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8 5 0
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1 5.5 7.3
1.5 5.5 7.7
2 5.5 7
2.5 5.5 6.9
3 5.5 5.5
3.5 5.5 4.4
4 5.5 3.2
4.5 5.5 1.3
5 5.5 0.6
5.5 5.5 0
6 5.5 0
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7 5.5 0
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8 5.5 0
8.5 5.5 0
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2 6 8.3
2.5 6 7.6
3 6 6
3.5 6 5.3
4 6 3.14
4.5 6 1.64
5 6 0.74
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6 6 0
6.5 6 0
7 6 0
7.5 6 0
8 6 0
8.5 6 0
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1 6.5 8.4
1.5 6.5 8.6
2 6.5 7.9
2.5 6.5 7
3 6.5 6.1
3.5 6.5 4.8
4 6.5 3.4
4.5 6.5 1.5
5 6.5 1
5.5 6.5 0.51
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6.5 6.5 0
7 6.5 0
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8 6.5 0
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1 7 8.8
1.5 7 8.6
2 7 8
2.5 7 7.26
3 7 6.2
3.5 7 5.1
4 7 3.9
4.5 7 2.4
5 7 2.06
5.5 7 0.34
6 7 0
6.5 7 0
7 7 0
7.5 7 0
8 7 0
8.5 7 0
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1 7.5 8.6
1.5 7.5 8.4
2 7.5 7.9
2.5 7.5 7.7
3 7.5 6.6
3.5 7.5 5.7
4 7.5 4.7
4.5 7.5 3.3
5 7.5 3.2
5.5 7.5 1.2
6 7.5 0.27
6.5 7.5 0
7 7.5 0
7.5 7.5 0
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1 8 9
1.5 8 8.7
2 8 8.3
2.5 8 8.2
3 8 7.3
3.5 8 6.5
4 8 5.8
4.5 8 4.4
5 8 4
5.5 8 1.8
6 8 0.9
6.5 8 0
7 8 0
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8 8 0
8.5 8 0
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1 8.5 9.6
1.5 8.5 9.2
2 8.5 9
2.5 8.5 8.5
3 8.5 8
3.5 8.5 7.2
4 8.5 6.4
4.5 8.5 5.3
5 8.5 5.1
5.5 8.5 2.9
6 8.5 1.7
6.5 8.5 0.57
7 8.5 0
7.5 8.5 0
8 8.5 0
8.5 8.5 0
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1 9 9.7
1.5 9 9.4
2 9 9.2
2.5 9 9
3 9 8.5
3.5 9 7.7
4 9 7.1
4.5 9 6
5 9 5.8
5.5 9 4
6 9 2.8
6.5 9 1.1
7 9 0.32
7.5 9 0
8 9 0
8.5 9 0
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1 9.5 10.4
1.5 9.5 10.2
2 9.5 9.8
2.5 9.5 9.6
3 9.5 8.8
3.5 9.5 8.5
4 9.5 7.8
4.5 9.5 6.8
5 9.5 6.6
5.5 9.5 4.8
6 9.5 3.3
6.5 9.5 1.7
7 9.5 0.6
7.5 9.5 0
8 9.5 0
8.5 9.5 0
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1 10 10.09
1.5 10 9.7
2 10 9.8
2.5 10 9.5
3 10 9.4
3.5 10 8.6
4 10 8.2
4.5 10 7.7
5 10 6.9
5.5 10 5.5
6 10 4.25
6.5 10 2
7 10 1
7.5 10 0
8 10 0
8.5 10 0
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1 10.5 10
1.5 10.5 9.9
2 10.5 9.8
2.5 10.5 9.9
3 10.5 9.7
3.5 10.5 9
4 10.5 8.6
4.5 10.5 7.9
5 10.5 7.1
5.5 10.5 6.1
6 10.5 4.8
6.5 10.5 3.1
7 10.5 1.6
7.5 10.5 0.48
8 10.5 0
8.5 10.5 0
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1 11 10
1.5 11 10
2 11 10
2.5 11 10
3 11 9.5
3.5 11 9.1
4 11 8.4
4.5 11 8
5 11 7.7
5.5 11 6.4
6 11 5.3
6.5 11 3.7
7 11 2.4
7.5 11 1.3
8 11 0
8.5 11 0
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1 11.5 10.1
1.5 11.5 10
2 11.5 10
2.5 11.5 9.9
3 11.5 9.4
3.5 11.5 9.1
4 11.5 8.4
4.5 11.5 8.2
5 11.5 7.3
5.5 11.5 7
6 11.5 5.9
6.5 11.5 4.2
7 11.5 2.3
7.5 11.5 1.6
8 11.5 0
8.5 11.5 0
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1 12 9.7
1.5 12 9.6
2 12 9.2
2.5 12 9.5
3 12 9.8
3.5 12 9.1
4 12 8.5
4.5 12 8
5 12 7.4
5.5 12 6.6
6 12 5.5
6.5 12 3
7 12 2.2
7.5 12 1
8 12 0
8.5 12 0
0.5 12.5 10
1 12.5 9.6
1.5 12.5 9.2
2 12.5 9
2.5 12.5 9.5
3 12.5 9.2
3.5 12.5 9.2
4 12.5 8.8
4.5 12.5 8
5 12.5 6.1
5.5 12.5 6.3
6 12.5 5.4
6.5 12.5 3.6
7 12.5 2.2
7.5 12.5 1.4
8 12.5 0
8.5 12.5 0
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1 13 7.9
1.5 13 8
2 13 7.8
2.5 13 7.7
3 13 7.3
3.5 13 7.1
4 13 7
4.5 13 6.6
5 13 5.1
5.5 13 4.8
6 13 3.7
6.5 13 2.2
7 13 0.93
7.5 13 0
8 13 0
8.5 13 0
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1 13.5 7.7
1.5 13.5 7.4
2 13.5 7.4
2.5 13.5 7.1
3 13.5 6.7
3.5 13.5 6.5
4 13.5 6.1
4.5 13.5 5.7
5 13.5 3.9
5.5 13.5 4.3
6 13.5 3.3
6.5 13.5 1.7
7 13.5 0.8
7.5 13.5 0
8 13.5 0
8.5 13.5 0
0.5 14 6.8
1 14 6.8
1.5 14 6.8
2 14 6.8
2.5 14 6.3
3 14 6.3
3.5 14 6.2
4 14 5.6
4.5 14 5.1
5 14 3.4
5.5 14 3
6 14 2.2
6.5 14 1
7 14 0.43
7.5 14 0
8 14 0
8.5 14 0
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1 14.5 7
1.5 14.5 7.2
2 14.5 6.1
2.5 14.5 6.4
3 14.5 5.8
3.5 14.5 5.4
4 14.5 4.6
4.5 14.5 4.2
5 14.5 2.5
5.5 14.5 2.5
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1 15 5
1.5 15 4.9
2 15 4.7
2.5 15 4.8
3 15 4.6
3.5 15 4.2
4 15 3.8
4.5 15 3.3
5 15 1.8
5.5 15 1.6
6 15 0.8
6.5 15 0.3
7 15 0
7.5 15 0
8 15 0
8.5 15 0
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1 15.5 4.5
1.5 15.5 4.2
2 15.5 4
2.5 15.5 3.8
3 15.5 3.8
3.5 15.5 3.6
4 15.5 3
4.5 15.5 2.5
5 15.5 1
5.5 15.5 1.1
6 15.5 0.6
6.5 15.5 0
7 15.5 0
7.5 15.5 0
8 15.5 0
8.5 15.5 0
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1 16 3.9
1.5 16 3.8
2 16 3.8
2.5 16 3.5
3 16 3.1
3.5 16 2.7
4 16 2.2
4.5 16 1.6
5 16 0.3
5.5 16 0.5
6 16 0
6.5 16 0
7 16 0
7.5 16 0
8 16 0
8.5 16 0
0.5 16.5 2.4
1 16.5 2.4
1.5 16.5 2.4
2 16.5 2
2.5 16.5 1.8
3 16.5 1.6
3.5 16.5 1.3
4 16.5 0.9
4.5 16.5 0.8
5 16.5 0
5.5 16.5 0
6 16.5 0
6.5 16.5 0
7 16.5 0
7.5 16.5 0
8 16.5 0
8.5 16.5 0
0.5 17 1
1 17 1
1.5 17 1
2 17 0.7
2.5 17 0.7
3 17 0.6
3.5 17 0.4
4 17 0
4.5 17 0
5 17 0
5.5 17 0
6 17 0
6.5 17 0
7 17 0
7.5 17 0
8 17 0
8.5 17 0
0.5 17.5 0.6
1 17.5 0.68
1.5 17.5 0.58
2 17.5 0.3
2.5 17.5 0
3 17.5 0
3.5 17.5 0
4 17.5 0
4.5 17.5 0
5 17.5 0
5.5 17.5 0
6 17.5 0
6.5 17.5 0
7 17.5 0
7.5 17.5 0
8 17.5 0
8.5 17.5 0
0.5 18 0
1 18 0
1.5 18 0
2 18 0
2.5 18 0
3 18 0
3.5 18 0
4 18 0
4.5 18 0
5 18 0
5.5 18 0
6 18 0
6.5 18 0
7 18 0
7.5 18 0
8 18 0
8.5 18 0

_________________
Ken

Ken, thank you for sharing this. This will save me a ton of trial and error time. PM sent (with gratitude).

I was wondering if DOT was Gibson's actual acronym.
At least ES electric spanish makes sense.

_________________
wah
Wah-wah-wah-wah
Wah

I don't think "DOT" has any significance. The earliest ES-335's had DOT inlays (and no fret board binding) as opposed to the pearloid block inlays they went to later.