Official Luthiers Forum!

Yep...perfect. That Pod HD500 goes SO far beyond ANY reasonably affordable set of pedals...you put that together with a little Fender Princeton or Deluxe Reverb there's no way to beat it on versatility. Frankly though...the stereo effects are far less dramatic without two amps...thus I recommend a small PA system...or a pair of powered monitors is all you'd really need.

For the money you spend on a little Fender Deluxe Reverb you could have a new Pod HD500 and a very NICE set of KRK Rokit 8's which are loud enough to damage your hearing in your living room. For live performance a pair of Mackie Thump TH 12A will destroy your whole head and leave a big gloppy mess. The point is...with a single amp and guitar there is one basic range of sounds available. With a Pod and some powered speakers....there's an entire WORLD of sounds which includes the modeling of the most popular amplifiers out there.....all for the same money as a little amp.

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I read Emerson on the can. A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds...true...but a consistent reading of Emerson has its uses nevertheless.

StuMusic

well I absolutely love my amp, but it's not for everyone. I was lucky enough to buy a Mesa Boogie out of the want ads about 14 years ago from a guy who thought it was a Mark III, so for many years I thought it was a Mark III. I actually didn't really like it at first because I just couldn't get it dialed in, mesa's circuit paths are cascading so slight changes have big impacts when you get to the subsequent knobs. Anyways, I actually had it sitting in a closet gathering dust and had decided to sell it, so I went to the interwebs to see if I could get a value. Around this time I noticed something, mine was not a Mark III which on ebay were going for around $800 at the time, about $200 more than what I paid for it. What I had, it turned out, was a Mark IIc+, which is one of the most sought after Mesa's of all time. They only made 2500 of them and they were shipped worldwide. I don't know if at this point they can all be accounted for, but anyways a conservative estimate based on recent sales puts the value at between $2500 and $3000. Also thanks to the internet I was able to download some cheat sheets going over how to set it up for different tones/genres. Now she sings like a siren and is every bit as much amp as a marshall stack, I've played multiple shows where it's the only rig not going through the house system and I have to drop volume. In fact that's the one thing, it goes from loud to jet engine in half a click. It's very versatile, has great clean tones and can go from subtle break up to screaming metal leads and into fusion. Not a bedroom rig though, if you want it in a small room you pretty much have to build a box for it or get an attenuator. I've had it set up before with a Boss ME-50 pedal running stereo outs to it and my Fender cyber twin and you can get real wacky there, but that's another story.

Two-Rock Dumble clone or Matchless DC30 - different beasts but seriously good fun

Ive played ALOT of amps over the years Marshalls, Peavy, many O'Fender, Boogies, Traynors, even a Roland once & other name brand amps.... some custom jobs and a Japanese "Custom Reverb" Fender clone that was hot rodded with real fender ballasts at some point, and that one smoked most of the expensive amps Ive played - wish I hadnt sold it...
Ive mainly gravitated toward Fenders and never had any luck with Marshalls, as Lincoln said but then again by the time I got interested in them the vintage models I was interested in were already pricey collectibles...
Ok now this brings me to about a year ago - I was in an amp limbo again.... I had a good Boogie - but I like a real rock & roll amp - something that can can cover the ground between Alvin Bishop to Zeppelin.... I dont need anything in the Metal zone - and thats where Id run into problems - Id find an amp with a good rock range but it would end up in ultrahardclipping distortiomundo beyond what I would ever need...
I got an inkling to revisit a Boogie I had played long before, but had really liked called the Lonestar....
Now I hear a collective sigh at the mention of Boogie because over the years they have leaned thier circuits toward the metal end of the scale... well I must say they are certainly coming full circle now my friends!
The Lonestar was different right from the get go - its clean channel is clearly modelled on the sounds of an ancient Fender which I am really comfortable with,,, now the second channel has an option that it can be selected to played like a hard ridden clipping tube'ed Fender, or a switch can select a more distorted mode this is where it gets fun - it really sings and wails without ever getting near metal sounds... IMO -
Also it has 2 separate drive controls, drive and gain - the range of each of these knobs is a revelation each revealing complex and rich elegant tones from crunch to full singing saturation.
There is a switch in ch2 that selects between normal, thick, and thicker, for more plexi reaching tones....
ALso in both channels there is the option to select normal or tweed settings - this tweed setting is sort of a built in variac that creates more of a brown sound a squishy puddle of thick drippy rock and roll awaits - within all of the above mentioned modes one can select between the 4ohm and 8 ohm cab settings which has a dramatic effect on tone as well!!! - finally there is the individual channel reverbs which is a nice touch...
There are other cool tools aboard like being able to select between 6L6 or EL34`s but this is practically standard fare for Boogies now - I got mine as a scratch and dent for $1499 new... used they are about the same, but worth every penny - ask anyone who has one - if you cant get a great tone out of this amp you cant play!
Good Luck on your amp hunt!
Cheers
Charliewood
PS the clean channel is beautiful and as good as any Ive ever played in any brand amplifier...nuff said

i had a Lone Star. sold it after a year. the distortion sounded like poo, and the cascading gain, even clean, was too much and annoying.

nyyazip
Did you have a Lonestar Special or a Lonestar Classic>? I have heard some ppl rip on the Clasics a bit, personally Ive never played the LS special(el84's for those who dont know) Mine sounds mint as have all the ones Ive ever heard and played - there is alot of features on the lonestars - if people dont have them configured right, admittedly they are a beast - once tamed - (well I can anyway) get heavenly distortion - there is so much variation in tube quality these days it really pays to take your amp to the music store and test drive any tubes you plan to buy -
Im not alone in my love of these amps.... and I think the accolades of the Lonestar speak for themselves - check out the press on them ..
they kick ass IMHO...
To ea his own however....
Again Good luck on the amp hunt
Cheers
Charliewood

charlie,
i had the regular old Lone Star(not the "special"). i just thought the clipping sounds were flabby and "un-aggressive" sounding for my tastes. i wasn't in a situation where i could really crank it up though. at the time i didn't know anything about tubes either- but i don't believe different tubes influence sound nearly as much as people will have you believe, either...
as you say, to each his own... thats why there have been so many zillions of models of guitar amps out there.
....thats kinda why i recommended Marshall/Fender/Orange.....there's a reason they make certain models that have stayed in the game for a half century, and its not just good marketing !

Thats where I disagree strongly - tubes can vary widly batch to batch even within the same brand, they used to be made in American as well as European facilities in addition to the Czech, and Russian, Chinese, etc plants where they are made today... the quality control is not what it used to be and also the environmental regulations have made things more difficult in manufacturing.... In the old days they would build circuits around the specifications of a certain type(i.e 6V6) of tube and its specifications.... now they will design an amp around a certain brand/type of tube because the specification vary to a great extent - thats what Randall Smith has been doing lately.... (and I know for a fact he did with the LS) and I have to say it certainly is showing in the strength of thier model lines - trans atalantic, royal atlantic, electradyne, MarkV, RoadKing, 5:50 etc
They also rebrand thier own line of tubes - I tried GrooveTubes, & EH tubes in my new boogie man did I ever switch back to Boogie brand tubes quickly...
It was clear that the architecture of the amp was designed around a Boogie tube ...... now I buy up current 6L6 pairs/quartets whenever I have money '''' who knows what the future will bring?
I will post some soundclips or video and let the ppl decide whether the amp Im using is good sounding....
Cheers
Charliewood

I've been playing a Mesa/Boogie Studio .22 for 25 years it covers all the electric areas very well .
5 12AX7 pre amp and 2 EL 84's .
The modern version is called 5:25

While not a dream amp, I picked up a Vox VT15 this week for $100. It even came with an extra tube and footswitch.
What a joy to finally have real tube sound again.
I own six solid-state amps and the tube emulators just don't do it, although my Peavy 112 has an incredible clean sound.
I'd go for a tube amp.

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wah
Wah-wah-wah-wah
Wah

So between all the responses, pretty much every amp on the planet has been suggested, LOL!

My two cents: I love my 5E3 kit that I put together from Torres Engineering. It's great for testing out guitars that I've just set up because it's a great sounding amp with wonderful distortion when cranked up.

If I had to go out and buy an amp for gigs or whatever, I'd get a Rivera, 'cuz they're versatile and sound great, unlike Mesa Boogie, which are versatile, and sound like crap. The amps they're making today function and sound nothing like the first few amps they made that got the attention of the guitar world and made them famous.

My biggest gripe with most amps is the distortion channel. Preamp tube distortion always sounds brittle and buzzy to me, even on low settings, compared to single channel cranked up power tube distortion, which sounds smooth and full.

Rivera seems to have found a way to smooth that out some.

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Old growth, shmold growth!

I agree on the preamp tube distortion: I owned an old Champ amp. I put a rheosat on the output so I could crank it to 10 and used a mic preamp to increase the gain: is there such a thing as "clean" distortion? It sounded smooth and full.

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wah
Wah-wah-wah-wah
Wah

I'm a Marshall guy through and through. But there's another amp on your list that I would look hard at as well; the twin reverb. They are loud, fat and full, with a clean tone that's to die for. Add a good distortion or overdrive pedal and they'll do just about anything you need. MHO.
My ideal rig is a Marshall for dirt and the twin reverb for clean, both run to an a/b box. Heaven.

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Mike

The only thing nescessary for evil to thrive is for good men to do nothing.

I know someone who does just that, gets a great clean sound.

The distortion will be as good as your pedal.

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Old growth, shmold growth!

Dirt is a personal thing. Everyone's got their own preference. For me, a Marshall cranked up to within an inch of it's life is where it's at. YMMV.
But you do bring up a great point. Add one or more good pedals to that twin and it would be hard to beat, IMHO.

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Mike

The only thing nescessary for evil to thrive is for good men to do nothing.

I would look into a THD Flexi Fifty, I have one and consider it to be one of the finest amps ever made. Very,very nice clean,crunch like the finest Marshall but beefier low end.Huge sound.
It is also built like a tank to last a century. Made in the USA.

No matter what amp he eventually ends up with, may your boy give his favorite amp to his kid when the time comes.

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How long is that in luthyears?

The amp I built shane is actually a Dumble clone. I bought a Two-Rock at one point just to map the circuit. They're a little different. Same family, but just a hair different.

I had a Fuchs ODS 50. Great amp. I sold it last year, though. There are so many dumble style amps out there now, and so many people doing the Robben Ford/Larry Carlton thing that as soon as you hear it you can't help but have an expectation what you "should" be hearing. I also sold my beloved JCM800 channel switcher. I just play through a Fender Twin (a "The Twin...nice gain channel for a Fender) and a cheapy line 6 spyder I got as partial payment for the Marshall. FWIW, a 100W Fender Twin, even run in 25W mode, is just WAY too loud, and it's heavy and huge too.

IMHO, it's hard to beat a good clean amp and pedals for the vast majority of things you might do, unless you really like to crank the amp. Even my Fuchs, which has about the best bedroom level drive channel I've ever heard, really doesn't come alive until you open it up a bit (especially the clean channel) and 50 watts opened up is just way too loud for anything. I've never been much of a Fender guy until recently, but my next amp will be a smaller Fender. I guess it depends what kind of music you're into, but nice Fender, a chorus, a FullDrive 2 and maybe a delay will cover a lot of ground...I mean a LOT of ground.

BTW, just for fun, can anyone guess the guitar, amp/effects and recording equipment I used to record these?

http://www.ballofshame.com/flying/CliffsOfDoverEQd.mp3

http://www.ballofshame.com/flying/TrademarkEQd.mp3

I'll let this go for a little bit, and then I'll give the equipment and the story behind it. I'll give you a hint: it IS the old GuitarPort backing track, but the gear is NOT GuitarPort. That was only used for the backing track.

I might do better to guess the next lotto numbers for all the different gear there is out there.

But those are nice tones.

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I read Emerson on the can. A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds...true...but a consistent reading of Emerson has its uses nevertheless.

StuMusic

I've always liked Fenders so I'd go for a Deluxe Reverb.
Other fine choices...Dumble,Matchless,Mesa

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Anderson Guitars
Clearwater,Fl. 33755

No one wants to play, I guess. Anyhow, it's a strat through my old Boss GT-6 plugged straight into the effects loop return of a Fender Twin (the twin was basically just acting as a PA). The backing track is played out a speaker. It's recorded, at bedroom levels (you can even hear me say "Woops" on the Trademark track) through the built in mic on a laptop. I recorded it as part of a thread on tube vs solid state (digital modelling in this case), so I picked one of the toughest tones to copy and there you go. The laptop mic picked up a ton of bass, so I slightly brought the bass back on the recording until the backing track on the recording matched the backing track played through the same speakers. That's all the post processing I did.

Anyhow, I guess the point is that you can get some really usable tones, and even do some reasonably decent recording, with basically nothing for equipment.

Incidentally, my next amp will be a Egnater Rebel 30 combo. I'm trying to sell the Twin now to make room. My entire pedal board is already gone. I'm straight into the amp now.