| Official Luthiers Forum! http://mowrystrings.luthiersforum.com/forum/ |
|
| Bill Pentz PDF file on Cyclones http://mowrystrings.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10102&t=15089 |
Page 1 of 1 |
| Author: | Bruce Dickey [ Fri Dec 21, 2007 5:27 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
http://www.liwoodworkers.org/resources/files/CYCLONECOMMENTA RY.pdf I think Todd had an article maybe that counters this or at least discusses cyclones? This one makes a lot of sense out of why dust collectors don't work. Feel free to post links to other articles. |
|
| Author: | DannyV [ Sat Dec 22, 2007 4:39 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
That was pretty interesting. I'm in the midst of building a new shop and have been pondering dust collection. Seems there is a little more to it than I thought. So how many people out there use 6" pipe? Most of the non - cyclone models I have looked at have 4" ports. Would it function to run 6" pipe and reduce at the collector? And then what? Reduce at the machine because most machinery has 3" or 4" ports. I know diddly about air flow. I would be grateful if others could share their opinions and experiences with their setups. What size motors? Cannister or bag filter? It seems that cannister is the way to go but how quickly do they plug up? The cannisters have a cleaning handle. Are they effective? And lastly, cyclones opposed to the other type? And thanks for the link Bruce. This is a great topic. Ever though I have 2 lungs I'd like to keep them both in good working order. Merry Christmas Danny |
|
| Author: | grumpy [ Sat Dec 22, 2007 4:46 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Mine starts out at 8", then comes down to 6" runs everywhere. whatever system you're looking at, go two sizes bigger. You can't have too much flow.... Watch auctions for the big monsters: pennies on the dollar. I got my system for the price of a shop vac.... |
|
| Author: | Bruce Dickey [ Sat Dec 22, 2007 4:52 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Danny, here is a picture from a user. I think we are forced to use 4 and 2 inch connectors at the machines, because that is what they are manufactured with. The issue is entraining the most dangerous particles, it takes a lot of velocity. 6 inch pipe, 3 HP motor, few turns in the pipe, no restrictions. One of the guys showing his shop devised a simple six by four four wye. Here is a pic: 
He puts blast gates at all these six inch drops. I'm wondering where to get six inch blast gates? Also, I wonder how he sealed off the 4 inch pipes? I see an attaching screw to the 6 inch. |
|
| Author: | Bobc [ Sat Dec 22, 2007 3:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
I just finished running 6" metal "HVAC" pipe for my new shop. Lee Valley tools has some nice 6" , 5" and 4" self cleaning metal blast gates that are very reasonably priced. Most tools do have 4" connections but you can make new openings and retrofit with larger fittings. In my situation I had 2 Jet model 1100 DC. One with double bags and one with upper cannister. That cleaning handle really doesn't work that well. I turn on the DC and then use my air compressor to blow on the outside of the canister to clean. You can feel a big differance in suction. Due to budget constraints (New Hvac system ate up most of it) I triend something differant. I found that by removing the double 4" inlets at the machine that the opening is 6" I wyed the 2 DC's together with a 6" blast gate at each machine so that I can open both when running both machines or close one to run only one machine. The results? With both machunes running it will suck your hand into the pipe. I am a happy camper. Each run has a blastgate at the ceiling and 5" flex pipe for drops. It will do nicely until I can afford a new cyclone. |
|
| Author: | Howard Klepper [ Sun Dec 23, 2007 7:03 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
There is so much good information on Bill Pentz's site. He's done a great service. Not all of it is well-organized, so you need to read and look around a lot. He says that any reduction from 6" to 4", even right at the machine, will kill performance. What he suggests is to put a wye in that goes from the 6" to a 5" and a 3.5", with the machine's port opened to 5" and a 3.5" hood located on the machine's table. The basic formula is that you want to keep the cross sectional area of the 6" pipe, which is 36 pi. A pair of 4" ports is also a close approximation (32 pi). I haven't seen the 3.5" flex tubing anywhere. Anyone know where to get this? |
|
| Author: | WaddyThomson [ Sun Dec 23, 2007 1:10 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Oneida has it in 1" increments from 2" to 10", sold in increments of 5'. The price is per each 5 feet. HERE That's not worded very well. If you order 10 feet, you'll get a continuous length, and pay 2 x the 5' price. |
|
| Author: | DannyV [ Sun Dec 23, 2007 4:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Thanks all for keeping this going and putting out some great info that has come at a perfect time for me. Bruce, that home built "y" looks like it could be made to work. Here in Canada we're fortunate to to benefit from the wisdom of guys like Red Green. The man has a way with duct tape. Todd, What did you use for flanges on your machines? A bit of caulking and a few screws or pop rivets I guess? Bob, how do you open your blast gates when they're up high or are they low enough to reach without a ladder? They have remotes to turn the machine on/off. Remote blast gates.......it could sell. Howard, I stumbled on to Bill Pentz's site. That is a man dedicated to the cause. I haven't had a spare hour or two to go into it but I will. Best of the Season, Danny |
|
| Author: | Bobc [ Sun Dec 23, 2007 9:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Danny I use a piece of 1" x 2" 8' long with a notch cut in the end. A bit of a pain but I followed Bill's advice not to put the blast gates at the machine. Eventually I will install the remote blast gates. |
|
| Author: | Bruce Dickey [ Mon Dec 24, 2007 1:47 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Good article Todd. Those blast gates cost about 15 bucks each. I think in my shop there are six needed. Bob C, What was the reason for putting the blast gates near the trunk lines? Do the drops fill with sawdust? |
|
| Author: | DannyV [ Mon Dec 24, 2007 2:23 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Bruce, I was just reading on Bill Penze's site, yes , the drop downs fill with material and he thinks opening the gate and having a big wad of sawdust hit your impeller at one time might cause damage to it. Thanks for the great link Todd! Ho Ho Ho |
|
| Author: | Howard Klepper [ Mon Dec 24, 2007 6:55 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Anyone know where 3.5" duct and fittings can be found? |
|
| Author: | Kirt Myers [ Wed Dec 26, 2007 7:10 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Howard, McMaster Carr has some 3-1/2" hose. Don't know if they have the fittings you want. Check out part #K5290K53 |
|
| Author: | BOBP [ Wed Dec 26, 2007 10:25 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
I installed a penn state cyclone 3.5 hp with 6" pvc pipe mains w/5" drops and short length of 4"at the tool it works great on my jet 18" bandsaw, it will empty the bottom section after having used it with out the collector for a couple of days. I have it in a closet with a full louver door and I have to leave the door open or it will overheat. It moves a lot!!!of air,and I have only cleaned it one time,other tools in the closet stay clean.The filters work great .5 micron is the way to go. The tools that are hooked up are completly dust free.(when I remember to turn it on duh!) |
|
| Author: | Bruce Dickey [ Wed Dec 26, 2007 12:52 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Hi BobP, I've been installing my mini Cyclone on a Shop vac today. Eliminating the hose seems to make sense, but I'll know more after operating it for a while. I plan on upgrading my 9 Foot tall 1500 CFM 2HP Delta two bagger to a ClearVue Cyclone upgrade. I've decided to vent outside and eliminate the filters altogether. Also.... On your setup, you mention 3.5 HP motor. did you build your own? I ask because ClearVue only offeres 5 HP Leeson motor. I'm planning on gutting my Delta and converting it to power a cyclone with 6 inch lines. Just curious how you did it? |
|
| Author: | Bruce Dickey [ Thu Dec 27, 2007 2:38 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Todd, yeah, I laugh when reading the labels on the Shop Vac. 5.5 Peak HP on 110V and 11.5A. Peak is in small letters. |
|
| Author: | Bruce Dickey [ Thu Dec 27, 2007 2:52 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Leeson Compressor Motors are listed at 230V 20A and 5HP. So, one thing at least they are heavy and require a bunch of power. Should get stuff spinning pretty good. |
|
| Page 1 of 1 | All times are UTC - 5 hours |
| Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group http://www.phpbb.com/ |
|
