Official Luthiers Forum!
http://mowrystrings.luthiersforum.com/forum/

Offset Fret Crowing File - Better ?
http://mowrystrings.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10102&t=14637		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  rich altieri [ Fri Nov 23, 2007 12:18 am ]
Post subject: 
I have been using a fret crowining tool from stewmac for some time and thinking of purchasing the offset type. Not always happy with how my fret ends come out with the one i use now.
I am sure some of you have used both styles and wondering if the offset type offers advantages.


the red one is the one i use now


this is the set i am considering

thanks in advance for your feedback
Author:  Evan Gluck [ Fri Nov 23, 2007 2:04 am ]
Post subject: 
Hi Rich,
I use the offset ones everyday. They are great. They are comfy as well so if you do a lot of fret work that is a plus.
Best, Evan
Author:  Dave Anderson [ Fri Nov 23, 2007 2:08 am ]
Post subject: 
Rich, They are better to use on the frets in the fb. extension over the body. Your fingers tend to hit the body with the flat files.The offset is perfect for this IMO.
Author:  Todd Rose [ Fri Nov 23, 2007 2:37 am ]
Post subject: 
I've been using this one, and I'm perfectly happy with it. I don't use it on the fret ends, though, just for recrowning. For the ends I use a 3 corner file to knock off the sharp edges; the rest is done with sandpaper and micromesh.

I haven't tried the "offset" diamond one pictured above. If some of you have tried that one and found that it works better for you than the one pictured here (i.e. you've tried them both), I'd be interested to hear about that.

Author:  Bob Garrish [ Fri Nov 23, 2007 3:55 am ]
Post subject: 
I haven't used the one Todd pictures above, but I can say that the offset diamond files are a total pleasure to work with. I think they're in a whole different league of tool than a toothed fret file. Might be the diamonds, might be the ease of use, but dollar for dollar I think it's one of my favourite tools (well, besides my giant $15 adjustable wrench...). I got the 300 grit version and don't foresee ever needing a faster cut.
Author:  tommygoat [ Fri Nov 23, 2007 5:21 am ]
Post subject: 
Another vote for the diamond offset file. Comfortable and efficient. I have the 300. Expensive, but worth it.
Author:  David R White [ Fri Nov 23, 2007 9:46 am ]
Post subject: 
One more vote for the diamond offset file, it's great, and of course you can use it flat if you ever need to.
Author:  rich altieri [ Fri Nov 23, 2007 3:09 pm ]
Post subject: 
thanks guys for the feedback. WIll make the purchase this weekend.

Todd, I dont use the rounding file for fret ends and use an edge file also. But when I round the frets sometimes the ends get rounded instead of having that nice 30 degree angle. Might be doing my fret work in the wrong order. Perhaphs I should be doing the leveling and rounding and then do a touch up on the ends.
Author:  FishtownMike [ Fri Nov 23, 2007 3:23 pm ]
Post subject: 
I have the gurian style with the 3 interchangable burrs and I also have the ones in your top pic. I prefer them over the gurian but I use the gurian over the body frets. Its easier to use up there.
Author:  David Collins [ Sat Nov 24, 2007 2:42 am ]
Post subject: 
I have or have had every file mentioned and pictured above, and of those the
offsets you are considering are my favorite so far. I still use my three corner
file a fair amount, but after years of dabbling with the diamond files I'm
warming up to them for a wider variety of fret work.

I've never used them as a tool for rounding fret ends. I still do that with a
very fine three corner file, usually almost right before the final polishing.

All my fret dressing and polishing methods I think are about to change
radically though. I hate to tease, but I'm waiting on a few tools and have
some things to build before I can post details. Chances are good though,
that those 300 grit offset files you're looking at will remain a part of my
procedures.
Author:  Todd Rose [ Sat Nov 24, 2007 10:39 pm ]
Post subject: 
[QUOTE=rich altieri]

Todd, I dont use the rounding file for fret ends and use an edge file also. But when I round the frets sometimes the ends get rounded instead of having that nice 30 degree angle. Might be doing my fret work in the wrong order. Perhaphs I should be doing the leveling and rounding and then do a touch up on the ends.[/QUOTE]

Rich, it sounds like you are using the recrowning file on the top of the fret, rather than on the "shoulders" only. Otherwise, I don't see how you could be changing the angle between the top of the crown and the fret ends. If I'm getting this right, then you're also likely mucking up the fret heights in the process of recrowning. I suspect this is a common mistake, because the concave edge of fret rounding files suggests that you should just file directly down on the top of the fret to produce the rounded crown. Not so.

After leveling the frets (which shouldn't flatten the fret tops much at all if you've properly leveled the board and seated the frets), take a colored marker and color all the fret tops. Then recrown by removing material from the shoulders of the fret only, leaving a very thin line of color down the middle. Light sanding/polishing will remove the color and shine everything up without changing the fret heights you achieved during the leveling phase.

Make sense?
Author:  Bill Greene [ Sun Nov 25, 2007 2:01 am ]
Post subject: 
Todd:

I'm glad you brought this up. On my most recent fret job, I used (for a portion of the frets) the red knobbed dual grit file above...and what you described is exactly what I thought was happening. It looked, to me, like I just flattened the top of the fret with the file, and didn't round the shoulders much. So I went back to the pillar file I'd been using, which I find a bit faster. I'm guessing I was just using the file at a "too vertical" angle. Thanks for that info. I may give these another shot at some point.
Author:  David Collins [ Sun Nov 25, 2007 5:03 am ]
Post subject: 
Ideally you would be able to use the file straight on the top or angled to
the shoulders, assuming the file were a perfect dome with a radius that
matched the fret shape, but as Todd said, it doesn't work that way. Of
course to serve more than one fret wire the curve really has to be
widened out, with the intention of cutting somewhat on the shoulders.
Unfortunately, some files make this even worse by having a poorly shaped
cutting surface.

The angled / dual grit files I got from StewMac had some pretty poor
shapes to the cutting surfaces. The "wide" is good for cutting straight
down, as it has a pretty good evan radius, while the "medium" is better
used for really wide frets, and even then it's more of a plateau form so is
better for coming at the sides. The "narrow" version is okay for medium
to narrow frets because of it's width, but it still has a pretty wide radius.
At best, even the best of these diamond files is going to have a much
much much wider radius than the shape of the fret, so they will need to
be rocked to each side to really form the frets. Both of the files in the first
post have a much better shape than the angled dual-grit files.

If you are going to use any pre-shaped file for crowning frets, I think it's
always a good idea to familiarize yourself with the actual shape of the file
you're cutting with. Take a thin piece of metal like 3/32" brass or
something, and cut away one edge leaving a small tab sticking out cut to
the width of the widest part of the file's cutting surface. Then clamp the
plate in a vise and shape the tab with your file, keeping the file perfectly
straight and vertical. Compare that to a clean 90 degree end cut of the
frets you are dressing and you may be surprised how different they are.
Just being more aware of the shapes can do a great deal to help guide
you in how and where to cut.
Page 1 of 1 All times are UTC - 5 hours
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
http://www.phpbb.com/