| Official Luthiers Forum! http://mowrystrings.luthiersforum.com/forum/ |
|
| Inletting braces into heel block http://mowrystrings.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10102&t=13938 |
Page 1 of 1 |
| Author: | Allen McFarlen [ Mon Oct 08, 2007 7:28 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
My last post seems to have gone un-noticed or perhaps nobody had an answer, so I'll try again. I'm using 6x6 mm sound hole braces that are going to be inlet into the heel block finger board extention. I'm a bit stumped at how to go about getting a really tight fit. If I glue the braces to the sound board, then I can't see and scribe a line on the heel block as you would when inleting the x-braces into the sides. Any ideas on how to accomplish this? Here's the plan that I'm using.  |
|
| Author: | Steve Saville [ Mon Oct 08, 2007 7:37 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
I wouldn't do that. Have those braces stop at the transverse brace and have the heel block but up against the transverse brace instead. |
|
| Author: | Michael Dale Payne [ Mon Oct 08, 2007 8:03 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Ditto |
|
| Author: | Rod True [ Mon Oct 08, 2007 8:14 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Ya what those guys said. |
|
| Author: | Grant Goltz [ Mon Oct 08, 2007 10:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
And why not? Just saying "don't do it" conveys no helpful information. I have been doing this for years, and I see no problem. Please explain the reasons for your opinions. Thanks. Grant Goltz |
|
| Author: | Steve Saville [ Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:01 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Grant, I don't see much of a problem, but I also don't see a benefit in doing it. IMO, it is a extra work that adds no value and weakens the transverse brace. Do you believe that it is needed to counteract the rotational force of neck on the top? (Why do you do it that way?) |
|
| Author: | Grant Goltz [ Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:08 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
I do it that way because I use an adjustable neck system that does not allow for "traditional" bracing above the soundhole. Grant |
|
| Author: | Steve Saville [ Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:17 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Grant, I'd love to see what you do. Do you have flying buttresses and use set screws to adjust the neck? |
|
| Author: | JohnAbercrombie [ Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:20 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Allen- I've inlet braces like this ('A' frame into block-didn't Lowden guitars have this?), and it isn't that difficult to do. You can either mark the block/rim assy from the braced soundboard, or cut the dadoes into the block first (I made a quick router jig for this) and then use that to align the braces for gluing on the soundboard. However, with your fingerboard extension support block getting so close to the transverse brace, I really don't see the point of bothering with this. If I were doing it according to your plan, I'd butt the soundhole braces against one side of the transverse brace, and butt the fingerboard extension up to the other side. Plan ahead when profiling the transverse brace so you have a good flat area for butting against. Cheers John |
|
| Author: | Terry Stowell [ Mon Oct 08, 2007 2:34 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
hmmm. I smell a tutorial coming on here.... break out the cameras guys! |
|
| Author: | Rod True [ Mon Oct 08, 2007 3:06 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Sorry Grant, In Steve's first post he mentioned pushing the head block back to but up against the UTB. With the head block extending this far, there is no advantage in bringing the soundhole braces through the UTB and into the head block. Therefore any extra work (not that it would be a lot) inletting the braces into the head block would not be beneficial IMO. |
|
| Author: | Allen McFarlen [ Mon Oct 08, 2007 6:51 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Hmm....the reason that I was going this route was a thread a while ago that seemed to indicate it was a good idea. I think Alan Carruth had indicated that he used a system similar to this as well as a couple of others. Saying that they felt it significantly reduced the need for neck resets etc. Perhaps I read it on the MMIF. Can't recall now. Up till now I've braced my tops just as was suggested with the neck support block butted up next to the transverse brace and the sound hole braces butting up to the x-brace and transverse brace. The reason that I've used a long neck block extension is that I use a double tenon fully bolt on neck. Now that I've read some of the reasoning to my bracing profile they do make some sense. The tutorial is a good idea though  . I don't think I'm all that qualified for this one this time around though. |
|
| Author: | tippie53 [ Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:10 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
I wouldn't suggest to do this style and I will tell you why. The guitar over time will be reshaped by stress. The neck having to carry the load of the strings will be torquing on the neck block. Here is what happens , the neck block will rotate and this will cause the back to flatten out and the sides to actually reshape. The top will be under a compressive load from the neck to the saddle and then tensional load from the saddle to the tail. Also there is some rotational forces applied at the bridge. With the rotational and compressive force you will see the top deform. While this may seem to help you may actually loose some of the performance off the top and thus loose some tonal voice. You won't stop the the changes just maybe delay them but now that brace will through other forces on the top and the angle of the braces may cause you some problems as the resultant forces off the angle may possible crack the top in this location. I have seen some guitar where then braced this by adding a block at the waist on both sides. This has been a practice by some builders for some time but hasn't been a popular technique. Still if you want to do it don't let us deter you , you will find that you learn more from a failure than a success. |
|
| Author: | Allen McFarlen [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 7:26 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
You've got me convinced. It was looking like a lot of work that has questionable benefits. Thanks for the responses. |
|
| Author: | KentF [ Wed Oct 10, 2007 5:28 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Isn't this basically the A-Frame bracing system Martin has been using for the last 10 years or so on many of it's models. Kent |
|
| Author: | Mattia Valente [ Wed Oct 10, 2007 8:15 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Plenty of Lowdens made this way (inlet A frame) that are doing just fine. I've done it on my first two, and as has been said, it's not difficult to do. And there are more than enough guitars out there that successfully use this system. I don't see how this would be any worse than not inletting, and inletting will help lock in the top a little better. I say do it. |
|
| Page 1 of 1 | All times are UTC - 5 hours |
| Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group http://www.phpbb.com/ |
|