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linings for a small Torres
http://mowrystrings.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=56057		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Ken Nagy [ Wed Nov 15, 2023 6:54 pm ]
Post subject:  linings for a small Torres
I'm making up a bunch of easy forms to check the bend of sides on the models I have started. I'm only doing one side, and making them wide enough so I can glue the upper linings in place. Some of the plans show the lining depth, most don't.

The Torres patterns don't show the linings. The small Torres pattern is pretty thin, 72-76 mm I think. I read that Torres didn't use the individual tentalones. Is that true? How big do you make the linings? Violin linings are only 8 X 2 mm. Cello about 15 X 3 mm. A Torres guitar is puny compared to a cello, how big should they be?

I do see that the plans show a kerfed lining on the belly about 6mm wide on the large one, and 5mm wide on the small one. That big?
Author:  jfmckenna [ Wed Nov 15, 2023 11:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: linings for a small Torres
I generally make them as small as possible given the purfling scheme.
Author:  Ken Nagy [ Thu Nov 16, 2023 7:10 am ]
Post subject:  Re: linings for a small Torres
I never thought about purflings and bindings needing the support of the linings. Duh. Some guitars are built like Battleships. These are not.
Author:  jfmckenna [ Thu Nov 16, 2023 8:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: linings for a small Torres
Some guitars, I have an old SS Stewart like this, has the highly decorated purfling that goes over the linings but it doesn't seem like a good idea to me. I always wanted to go at least 1/16th in past the thinning of the top for the purfling.
Author:  Ken Nagy [ Thu Nov 16, 2023 8:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: linings for a small Torres
Sounds like a good idea to me. The plan doesn't even say anything about binding or purfling. From photos and videos, it doesn't seem like they are that big. I'll have to do a search to see. They give all the details of the rosette though. I'm thinking of doing similar rosettes, but just using natural woods.

I have 3 of the 4 forms done. One piece of 1/8" 24 X 48 hardboard, and a couple 1 X 2's. I should get 1/2 patterns too. Paper moves. Hardboard doesn't. Would probably only get 3 more normal sized guitars out of a 2 X 4 foot piece.

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Author:  Clay S. [ Thu Nov 16, 2023 9:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: linings for a small Torres
Most of the SS Stewart guitars I've run across were "Parlor" guitars with fairly thick tops - but I agree it is better to have the lining extend past the purfling rebate.
I have used fairly "thick" linings when I have made the purfling channels the same depth as the bindings. For simple purfling schemes you can get away with doing this and install them both at the same time.
I've also read that Torres used kerfed linings, and that he fitted and glued the back braces to the sides and then glued the back to the braces as he was gluing the back to the sides. He must have been pretty quick with the hide glue!
Author:  DennisK [ Thu Nov 16, 2023 10:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: linings for a small Torres
Assuming you're using wood binding, then 1-1.5mm thicker than the purfling should be fine. As long as it doesn't fall apart under the pressure of clamping the binding, you should be good. Plastic binding I'd make them thicker, so you're not depending on the plastic-to-wood joint as part of the structure.

You can see some very thin linings here, with kerfs made by pressing rather than sawing http://www.vintageguitar.com/3434/antonio-de-torres-1863/
Author:  Dave m2 [ Thu Nov 16, 2023 11:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: linings for a small Torres
Jeff Elliot in his drawing of Torres SE114 shows kerfed linings for top and back of about 6.5 m width and 13.5 depth.

On my interpretation I have used rather greater depth.

Dave
Author:  jfmckenna [ Thu Nov 16, 2023 1:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: linings for a small Torres
Clay S. wrote:
Most of the SS Stewart guitars I've run across were "Parlor" guitars with fairly thick tops - but I agree it is better to have the lining extend past the purfling rebate.
I have used fairly "thick" linings when I have made the purfling channels the same depth as the bindings. For simple purfling schemes you can get away with doing this and install them both at the same time.
I've also read that Torres used kerfed linings, and that he fitted and glued the back braces to the sides and then glued the back to the braces as he was gluing the back to the sides. He must have been pretty quick with the hide glue!


This one is certainly unique. Ghrun suggested that it was made by Regal in 1925. I can only imagine with this amount of marquetry involved that it was a top line offering. It is a parlor guitar though.

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