Official Luthiers Forum!

I installed the Pure Minis in my two players. My Dred and my parlor. I was never a fan of pickups in acoustic guitars and have never owned one until now. I am playing them through a Fender Rumble bass amp and both guitar sound better than i had hoped. I know that I'm a little late to the dance, but I'm very happy.

I like them too. So do many others, I have installed quite a few in the last 10 years. For performing I run mine through a Red-Eye Twin preamp with a touch of Blue Sky Reverb and Chorus then into the sound system.

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Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

Super glue installation is a deal breaker for me. I've tried to remove them with single edge razor with poor results. It's a bit hair raising experience to try to manipulate a sharp razor by feel alone with your hand inside the guitar. Maybe there's a trick but the non-reversible (or nearly) nature sours the appeal of K&K.
I don't mean to hijack the thread but I'm a big fan of Trance Audio Amulet with volume but without tone control. Considerably more $ than K&K but much a better installation and, to me at least, a better sound.

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Stay with the happy people.
--Reynolds Large

We have successfully removed them but you're right Tom it's highly unlikely that the removal will be successful without destroying the transducers. So we advise clients that removing will likely destroy the transducers but the installation is reversible in the sense the pup is removable and I would consider some others like the Marcus Berry of days gone by and the Baggs Ibeam to be harder to remove.

We have commonly been called to help with non-CA-glued K&K transducers falling off and usually at a gig it seems. So we CA and also see tonal advantages to a secure coupling of the transducers and not though a dampening piece of tape.

Dave just made a new video of K&K installation using a new vacuum tool for holding the transducers that he invented.

At what, $125 street price where they were $99 just a few years ago it's one of the least expensive pups and I would even consider them at that price point to be a throw away if someone doesn't bond with them.

We love them and specifically in flat picking steel strings. My personal pup favorites are K&K pure mini, Baggs Lyric and Baggs Anthem. I can find something for more people in these three pups. Fishman has great stuff too no disrespect intended. In the last ten years many pups have improved vastly over the crap of the past.

Sounds like a great set-up Steve and the Blue Sky is a stellar reverb box, one of the best ever.

An advantage of a pickup like the K&K to the working musician is its robust nature. The transducers, glued securely, and cable well-routed with no points of strain makes for a very durable and trouble-free system in service. About the only issue I see with these in service is the jack wearing out eventually, which is an easy repair.


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Exactly - Pro tip for those that don't know this. I string out the pup on the top of the guitar and see if there is room for one knot (not tight just a looping) of the main cable in the middle of the span and still have the three transducers being able to be pulled just in view in the sound hole. This cable knot takes up all the cable slack on OOO and dread sized guitars so the cable is suspended in the box and won't hit the back, top or sides meaning no cable retainers to come loose or install.

The way to glue the transducers without gluing yourself if you do this by hand and I've done most of mine by hand until now is your CA dot size. I use medium CA and try to keep my dot of CA on the middle of the transducer to around 1/8" in diameter this will spread out even beyond the edges in places but is not excessive.

Pro tip II - We check the bridge plate for smoothness first and if it's not smooth with perhaps some chips from the dang slotted pins eating the bridge plate pin hole edges I lightly sand it with quad folded 220 to remove an loose wood. Then I invert the guitar to shake any loose stuff in the box to where a cut-away would be and stick my vac in there taking care to never close off the rest of the sound hole with my arm.

Once the plate is wiped with a paper towel of sanding dust I spray accelerator on a paper towel and rub it on the bridge plate. This greatly speeds up the "grab" of the 1/8" dot of medium CA when the transducers are positioned and pressed home.

Pro tip III - Don't drill a 1/2 inch hole and instead go to David Collins Youtube video channel and find his video that's been used by thousands for years on how and why we ream with the Stewmac excellent reamer the hole to under 1/2". It also explains a great way to snug up the jack that seems last for years in our experience without coming loose. This jack install method is applicable to any pup not just K&K.

The 1/2 inch hole is too big and a sloppy fit that when the jack starts to come loose this wiggle room in the hole speeds up it coming loose the rest of the way so no 1/2" holes please or you clients will be calling repair folks.

The K&K also a passive pup meaning no dang battery for someone to put in incorrectly and then have it come loose.

I looked down my nose at K&K for years because of the price point. My snobbery only served to make me wrong on this one it's a great pup. Don't be fooled by the low price it's excellent.

I think they are a tremendous value and they sound great too specifically with flat picking sorts.

I have a Lyric in my 2.9lb L-OO that I built in 2007 and play the very most when not shredding with electrics and although the Lyric is a great pup in a great sounding guitar the K&K would have been a better choice for me since I flat pick the vast majority of the time.

I have removed them in the past too but I generally consider them non-removable when I install them with CA and installing with CA is really the only way to go imho. I think they are fantastic.

Hesh I use a 15/32 bit that makes the perfect hole. I have seen too many with 1/2 holes that loosen.

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John Hall
blues creek guitars
Authorized CF Martin Repair
Co President of ASIA
You Don't know what you don't know until you know it

1/2" hole is just too big. I use the StewMac reamer.

I have removed K&K piezo disks, some without damage but I wouldn't guarantee it. The razor does not have to be "razor sharp", I use one of the single edge blades I've been using as a scraper so not as likely to cut you. Still, it's a pain to do and takes a while - glad it doesn't have to be done too often.

When I install the K&Ks I use a dot of GluBoost gel (I love that stuff) in the center of the disk. And I wear a nitrile glove, just in case

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

I removed one by turning the guitar upside down and using a long needle on a small syringe flooding the area around the transducers with acetone so it soaked into the bridge plate under the transducer. It was a long time ago but as I recall, after waiting a few minutes they all came off by keeping a steady pull on the wire for a few minutes. One transducer bent a little. I did not reuse the pickup.

Like I said it was a long time ago and I have not had to remove one since so take it for what it's worth.

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It's not what you don't know that hurts you, it's what you do know that's wrong.

+1 for the SM reamer! Makes a flawless hole with zero finish damage. I center a 1/4” hole using a bradpoint and the SM reamer follows the 1/4” hole perfectly. It’s going for about $120US - I think I gave $80 for mine but that was 10 years ago.

I also install K&K pickups in everything unless the client requests something else. I know Ed Bond aka Meddlingfool prefers Schatten pickups. They are similarly priced. I’ve yet to try one.

M

The SM reamer is one of those tools that is expensive for folks only doing a few installs, but is a bargain for regular uses.

I would pay $1000 for it and still consider it a bargain, it’s a money-making machine for those who install pickups - both for its efficiency but also in how it greatly reduces risk/liability when putting a jack in a high dollar guitar.

Hesh and I believe Mr Collins have posted in the past about how the reamer can be used to “walk” an off-Center hole back into position and this is a great feature as I often see instruments with slightly off-Center endpin holes from the factory.

Yeah the StewMac reamer is truly one of those tools that pays for itself very quickly for folks who do more than a few of these. It also seems to last a very long time. Mine is 15 years old and has done hundreds of installs and seems still to be very sharp.

It requires a drill with a 1/2" chuck.

I had a learning curve with mine and used to ream slowly and sneak up on it. Some of you here and Dave Collins advised me to go full bore and lean into it so that's what I do now and the reamer doesn't care. My drill will slow and then I back off to keep a constant, decent speed. Only takes maybe ten seconds if that.

Something else I like about the tool is the length. Once I secure the instrument in a leg vice taking care to keep it level the length of the reamer helps me keep the drill and reamer level too.

Another thing I thought if that I do is break the hard edges around the completed hole after reaming. Using an over sized reamer bit by hand backwards it breaks that finish edge nicely to help avoid chipping in the future.

Another tip I do is cover the sound hole with anything handy such as a towel, book, magazine, etc. to lesson the volume of the squeal when reaming, it can be quite loud.

Great tool and an excellent design, they nailed it.

I'll just mention an very good alternative to the SM reamer which doesn't chip the finish either.
After checking the jack diameter just in case..., I use a 12 mm (15/64" = 11.90625 mm) stepped reamer to open out any endpin hole, or to open up a small hole on a new build.
I use it chucked in a drill, and have never had any problem keeping it square with the body face down in a guitar holder.
I have also used this to "walk" an off centre endpin hole (drilled by me!)
In side edges I clean up with a conical reamer originally intended for chair making.

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The name catgut is confusing. There are two explanations for the mix up.

Catgut is an abbreviation of the word cattle gut. Gut strings are made from sheep or goat intestines, in the past even from horse, mule or donkey intestines.

Otherwise it could be from the word kitgut or kitstring. Kit meant fiddle, not kitten.

same here.