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Dishing Neck Cheeks
http://mowrystrings.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=54280		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  CarlD [ Sun Aug 01, 2021 3:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Dishing Neck Cheeks
There was a recent thread about dishing neck cheeks over on Acoustic Guitar Construction Forum. Here is my addition to that discussion. I thought some of you folks might like to try it too.

I've been using a dremel with rasp #199. Here's a pic with a piece of aluminum tubing over the shaft to prevent friction burns on the edge and keeping the cut shallow. The Taylor pic looks like a closeup of that type of rasp.
Attachment:
IMG_20210704_141655_4.jpg




Here's a pic of a neck heel with the recess cut out leaving a narrow edge for flossing. It was cut out before fretboard attachment and heel cap glued on.
Attachment:
IMG_20210704_141633_2.jpg




I'm liking butt joints more and more, so much easier to make the cheek recess with a router. :)
Author:  meddlingfool [ Sun Aug 01, 2021 5:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
I'm liking butt joints more and more, so much easier to make the cheek recess with a router. :)[/quote]

Ding!
Author:  phavriluk [ Sun Aug 01, 2021 5:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
Ed, you're going to cause a whole bunch of heart attacks among the dovetail worshipers when they read your comment.
Author:  Bryan Bear [ Sun Aug 01, 2021 6:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
I do a butt joint and have been doing this with a chisel. I cut the wall of the recess at a bit of an angle because it seems like having a right angle on such a narrow raised section could be a week point. I’m not really sure it matters, I could be making things more complicated for myself.
Author:  SteveSmith [ Sun Aug 01, 2021 8:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
I also use a chisel, a 10mm gouge. It’s easy and quick.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
Author:  meddlingfool [ Mon Aug 02, 2021 2:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
phavriluk wrote:
Ed, you're going to cause a whole bunch of heart attacks among the dovetail worshipers when they read your comment.


Scandalous!
Author:  banjopicks [ Mon Aug 02, 2021 7:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
I do it with a chisel but the Dremel sounds appealing, that is until I lose control of it and ruin the neck somehow.
Author:  banjopicks [ Mon Aug 02, 2021 7:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
SteveSmith wrote:
I also use a chisel, a 10mm gouge. It’s easy and quick.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


That's interesting. I just use a flat chisel but a gouge may be better, I'll give it a go.
Author:  bluescreek [ Mon Aug 02, 2021 8:12 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
chisel is safer and more controllable with a sharp corner you create , that becomes a stress riser that can shear out when you tighten the bolt
Author:  banjopicks [ Mon Aug 02, 2021 8:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
_ _
John your saying this made with a Dremel ____| | is worse than this mad with a chisel ____/ | I think.
Author:  Bryan Bear [ Mon Aug 02, 2021 9:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
bluescreek wrote:
chisel is safer and more controllable with a sharp corner you create , that becomes a stress riser that can shear out when you tighten the bolt


That is exactly what I was trying to communicate earlier (and didn't word well). Steve's suggestion of a gouge has me thinking. A curved transition would be even better than an angled one.
Author:  Barry Daniels [ Mon Aug 02, 2021 9:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
I feel safer using a sharp chisel to relieve the heel instead of a Dremel. And the stress riser comment is very true.
Author:  CarlD [ Mon Aug 02, 2021 11:12 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
I've done it this way for several years now on on about ten necks and have had no dremel control or edge break problems. Sure makes it easier to floss the neck fit.
Author:  Barry Daniels [ Mon Aug 02, 2021 1:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
Any problem would show up years down the road. Not saying it will, but it might be an issue. I just don't think leaving a thin, square edge like that is a good idea. It goes against all my training. The depth of the recess also looks excessive.
Author:  banjopicks [ Mon Aug 02, 2021 3:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
Attachment:
RightWrong.png


You think the one on the right will endure?
Author:  bluescreek [ Mon Aug 02, 2021 3:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
yes that sharp corner is a point of stress over time
Author:  Barry Daniels [ Mon Aug 02, 2021 3:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
Yes. But my cheek relief is less dramatic than in the right photo.
Author:  Clay S. [ Tue Aug 03, 2021 5:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
I am also in the chisel camp.
Like Barry, I make the relief less pronounced so that as you "floss" the neck the bearing surface of the neck heel to body joint increases. In a perfect world flossing to final fit the neck wouldn't be needed and there would be solid bearing between the surfaces.
Author:  Barry Daniels [ Tue Aug 17, 2021 11:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
I am tuning up a guitar I built 10 years ago and here is a photo of the shallow dishing I use. No stress risers here.
Author:  Hesh [ Wed Aug 18, 2021 4:38 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
Nothing like an uber sharp chisel for us.
Author:  jfmckenna [ Wed Aug 18, 2021 7:21 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
I do a bolt on butt joint too and strive hard to make wood to wood contact across the whole face. The reason why I do that is kind of funny but it's because when I started doing this type of neck joint it was on classical guitars and if you think steel string players who think that a dovetail is the only joint for best tone then well, you have not met many classical guitar players who think that a Spanish heel is the only way to build a guitar ;) Anyway when I tell them, classical Spanish lovers or dovetail-o-philes, that I make sure its all wood to wood contact you can kind of see them look up and to the right and think about it for a while till it makes enough sense to be acceptable.

It's not that hard to floss out with cloth backed paper. Just use one bolt at a time and snug it down then floss it. Why not?
Author:  banjopicks [ Wed Aug 18, 2021 8:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
Barry Daniels wrote:
I am tuning up a guitar I built 10 years ago and here is a photo of the shallow dishing I use. No stress risers here.


I like everything about this. I'm curious about the fretboard inserts you used and how they are installed.

Also, it appears that you used a shim under the fretboard. Is that what I'm seeing.
?
Author:  Barry Daniels [ Wed Aug 18, 2021 8:30 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dishing Neck Cheeks
Glad you like it Richard. I wondered if anyone would catch that detail. The inserts are T-nuts that lay under a cast in-place, epoxy graphite plate to provide a bolt-on fingerboard extension. But there is no shim under the fingerboard. Another detail is something I just did. See the brass pins on the side of the tenon? One brass insert was starting to pull out so I did a cross pin of brass to lock them down.
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