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12 fret 000 / 14 fret body shape
http://mowrystrings.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=53932		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Andy Bounsall [ Sat Feb 06, 2021 11:36 am ]
Post subject:  12 fret 000 / 14 fret body shape
I’m going to be doing my take on a 12 fret 000 sized guitar. I’ll likely be using a 25.25” scale as I find that quite comfortable. In order to push the bridge down nearer to the widest part of the lower bout, I’m thinking to use a standard OM/000 14 fret body shape (rather than the longer body shape of a traditional Martin 12 fret 000). The guitar will have a cutaway to allow access to the upper fretboard. Haven’t decided yet wether it’ll have a traditional center sound hole. If it does, the fretboard length will be reduced, likely to 18 or 19 total frets, and the sound hole will move down but by a lesser amount than the bridge. I might instead decide to move the sound hole to the upper bout (which I’ve done with success on GA sized guitars in the past). In either case, the top bracing will be adjusted to accommodate the modified bridge position, et all.

So I’m curious if anybody here has done something like this before and has any practical tips or suggestions they can share. Theoretical comments are welcomed as well but please identify them as such. Thanks.
Author:  Clay S. [ Sat Feb 06, 2021 12:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 12 fret 000 / 14 fret body shape
Martin did that on one of their signature guitars - Norman Blake I think.
https://www.elderly.com/products/martin ... blake-2005

I think it is the longer soundboard that gives the better sound of the 12 fret Martins. Even with those, Martin moved the sound holes around. Some of the early guitars had 18 and 19 fret fretboards.
Steve Grimes, among others, has done double soundholes in the upper bout on an "OMesque" type body. I once built an experimental guitar with two soundholes in the upper bout that were sized to accept electrical chord grommets which could be closed, fully open, or partly open. It was interesting to hear the differences it made to the sound.
Author:  SteveSmith [ Sat Feb 06, 2021 2:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 12 fret 000 / 14 fret body shape
I've done several 13 fret 000's on 14 fret OM bodies and they work just fine. I would not expect the 12 fret version to be much different.
Author:  Freeman [ Sat Feb 06, 2021 2:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 12 fret 000 / 14 fret body shape
I commented at your MIMF post

Attachment:
IMG_4478-3.jpg
Author:  PatrickW [ Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 12 fret 000 / 14 fret body shape
Andy, here is my last build a Norm Blake style OM 12 fret short scale.

[img]
Attachment:
F1191738-E64A-41AB-B6DD-847B13FC4288.jpeg
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Author:  Bryan Bear [ Sat Feb 06, 2021 7:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 12 fret 000 / 14 fret body shape
I’ve made a couple 12 fret O sized guitars using my body 14 fret body shape (length). Mine are 24.9” scale and the bracing is arranged around catching the front of the bridge wings with the X while keeping the angle as open as possible. I think moving the bridge back like that puts it in the larger area of the lower bout and puts a bit more space between the front of the bridge and the X intersection. Since these are smaller bodied guitars, I also made the sound holes a bit smaller and a bit forward shifted hoping to help bass response a bit.

Because of that, the fretboards are only 17 frets and there is a lot of space between the soundhole and bridge. I still have not come up with a pickgurd shape I like. I do like the sound of both of them quite a bit and I’m not a good enough player to miss the extra frets. I like the proportions quite a bit, it is just different enough to look interesting without looking strange.

Image


This body is 19.25 inches long. My parlor guitars use a similar approach but the bodies are only 18.25 inches long.


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Author:  ballbanjos [ Sat Feb 06, 2021 7:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 12 fret 000 / 14 fret body shape
I have to admit that I liked what Gibson did with the L-0/00 etc. series, keeping the 12 fret body shape but moving to a 13th or 14th fret neck joint while moving the soundhole and bridge accordingly. I like the rounder shoulders of the 12 fret Martins as well as the longer bodies. I was never big on the Martin OM body. Same reason I always liked the round shouldered Gibson J-45s better than the later square shouldered, Dreadnought looking bodies.

But there are a lot of great looking guitars on this thread that take it the other direction and I like 'em too.

Dave
Author:  Casey Cochran [ Sun Feb 07, 2021 5:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 12 fret 000 / 14 fret body shape
Image
This is 00-12 bracing on a 000-14 top. The tighter X brace angle puts the bridge over the X in the same spot as a forward shifted dread with a 25” scale and 12 frets clear.


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Author:  Andy Bounsall [ Mon Feb 08, 2021 11:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 12 fret 000 / 14 fret body shape
Thanks for all the replies and info folks. Martins 000 Norman Blake and Bourgeois 00-12 fret coupe (scaled up to a 000 ) are pretty close to what I’m planning. Great to see that others have successfully executed the same basic idea.

Patrick, would be interested in details/photo of how you braced the top on your ‘Blake style OM’ and to know how it sounds.

Casey, many thanks for that photo. Did you go with 1/4” for the X. Looks like it’s scalloped...but only on the treble side? Comments on how the guitar sounds?
Author:  Casey Cochran [ Mon Feb 08, 2021 12:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 12 fret 000 / 14 fret body shape
Yes, the X is 1/4". Fully scalloped, multiple lights on my bench caused it not to show in the photo. The guitar is not finished yet...
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