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| Author: | gtrboy77 [ Sun Dec 06, 2020 5:53 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Benedetto hand planes |
Not sure if this is the right place to post this, but I was wondering if any people had any experience using Bob Benedetto’s lutherie hand planes. I am curious if anyone likes them or uses anything they like better. I thought it was interesting that the double convex plane costs way more than the flat one. |
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| Author: | Barry Daniels [ Sun Dec 06, 2020 7:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Benedetto hand planes |
Sharpening a curved blade is a bit tricky and takes longer. I made my own copy of his planes back before they were available. They worked great on the spruce top but were not really usable on the hard maple back. |
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| Author: | gtrboy77 [ Sun Dec 06, 2020 7:53 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Benedetto hand planes |
I kind of wondered about that. I can’t imagine anything is really great on hard maple backs. Maybe a power tool like an Arbortech carver. I don’t suppose you want to reverse engineer his plane and share it? |
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| Author: | Pmaj7 [ Sun Dec 06, 2020 11:17 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Benedetto hand planes |
I wonder if these can do anything like what the coveted Boone planes can do. They look bigger... Pat |
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| Author: | gtrboy77 [ Mon Dec 07, 2020 5:19 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Benedetto hand planes |
Boone planes? Never heard of those. |
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| Author: | Ruby50 [ Mon Dec 07, 2020 7:30 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Benedetto hand planes |
James Krenov popularized this style of plane 40-50 years ago and there are dozens of tutorials on making them. Here is one of the best by Ron Hock https://hocktools.wordpress.com/2015/06/26/make-a-krenov-style-wooden-plane/ I bought a small (1-1/2") wooden smoother in reasonable shape for $10 and double-radiused the sole for windsor chair seats. Works great. Don't have a shot of the sole Ed M |
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| Author: | TerrenceMitchell [ Mon Dec 07, 2020 8:39 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Benedetto hand planes |
FWIW, I have a similar pair of tools for when I did chair seats. Similar result, but much harder to make, due to the blade shape. They work really well though: http://handtoolwoodworking.com/travishers/ |
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| Author: | SteveSmith [ Mon Dec 07, 2020 8:54 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Benedetto hand planes |
gtrboy77 wrote: Boone planes? Never heard of those. These were small wooden finger planes made by Luthier Stephen Boone who was a member here. Many of us bought them while they were available. They're nice little planes but as far as I know he quit making them some years ago. |
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| Author: | Ken Nagy [ Mon Dec 07, 2020 12:45 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Benedetto hand planes |
Planes are not hard to make. To make them well, you have to think about what you want to do. Most planes aren't perfect; even the ones you buy. I bought some brass Chinese finger planes. An entire set for less than the price of a couple. I replaced the blades with Japanese blades, and reworked every one of them extensively; now they work great. I have a plane with a wedge clamp that works well for finish cuts, but when I made one that way for roughing, It wouldn't stay put. A screw down clamp is easy; all you need is a piece of steel, or brass, and a tap. I made my rougher; the one that didn't work; for a cello, but I made it over, with slightly tighter curves for my arch top, and it works great. I designed the curves to just fit inside the arch when carving out the inside. I checked it long arch, and cross arch. If it isn't much more curved than the inside, then you can rough the inside out really easy, and not worry about going too far. As long as you have enough cross arch on the width, it will work on the outside. The Lie Nielson scrub plane blade will work right out of the box. I MAY have rounded it out more, and MAY have put a tighter relief angle on the bottom; but that's just me. It's a great start. If you use a thin blade, a Hock chipbreaker will make it a lot stiffer. I don't know if they still sell them. I made one out of 1/4" stock for my joiner with a removable end, so I can hone the blade without taking the chipbreaker off. Works great. I made it like the Hock plane link, but I put a harder sole on it, and used softer wood on the top. I also added shims; wings on the side of the blade so there is more chip clearance. Other than that, it is the same. You need to think about chip clearance. That was one of the main things I had to do with the brass finger planes. I made some little sketches. That's how I think. Attachment: IMG_0199.jpeg
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| Author: | TripodBob [ Mon Dec 07, 2020 1:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Benedetto hand planes |
Sharpening the curved plane blade was difficult until I happened upon directions to make the little sharpening jig pictured. The round head of the carriage bolt dictates the curve while grinding and sharpening. Incidentally the blade came from a cheap putty knife from a big box store. It will do a spruce top and a maple back before it needs resharpening. Attachment: IM001606.JPG Attachment: IM001603.JPG
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| Author: | Darrel Friesen [ Mon Dec 07, 2020 1:22 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Benedetto hand planes |
I've been meaning to build a similar one to the Benedetto plane to see how it compares to my Ibex ones. The 90mm Ibex has a satisfying heft to it and carves both spruce and maple very well. A glove is required PPE though, at least for me. I also have a couple of the smaller Ibex planes and various other gouges, spoon planes etc. The wooden planes seem too light to me especially for hogging out wood. Could be just my perception though as they have obviously been used by many luthiers in the past. When I was building my archtop bass guitars, I elected to use a Kutzall disc on a grinder. Worked very well but dusted up the neighborhood! |
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| Author: | gtrboy77 [ Mon Dec 07, 2020 9:42 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Benedetto hand planes |
Wow, thanks for all the input and ideas. I may have to try my hand at making some little Krenov style planes. |
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| Author: | gtrboy77 [ Tue Dec 08, 2020 6:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Benedetto hand planes |
I guess another question would be, if I was going to make a double convex radius plane, what is a good radius to do the inside of an arch top ? What would be a good radius across the length and the width? |
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| Author: | Darrel Friesen [ Tue Dec 08, 2020 9:16 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Benedetto hand planes |
SteveSmith wrote: gtrboy77 wrote: Boone planes? Never heard of those. These were small wooden finger planes made by Luthier Stephen Boone who was a member here. Many of us bought them while they were available. They're nice little planes but as far as I know he quit making them some years ago. I recall those. Great little planes but seem to remember them as being excellent for shaving braces, not so much for carving archtop plates. |
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| Author: | SteveSmith [ Wed Dec 09, 2020 6:57 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Benedetto hand planes |
Darrel Friesen wrote: SteveSmith wrote: gtrboy77 wrote: Boone planes? Never heard of those. These were small wooden finger planes made by Luthier Stephen Boone who was a member here. Many of us bought them while they were available. They're nice little planes but as far as I know he quit making them some years ago. I recall those. Great little planes but seem to remember them as being excellent for shaving braces, not so much for carving archtop plates. |
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| Author: | Ken Nagy [ Wed Dec 09, 2020 10:04 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Benedetto hand planes |
gtrboy77 wrote: I guess another question would be, if I was going to make a double convex radius plane, what is a good radius to do the inside of an arch top ? What would be a good radius across the length and the width? I don't use radii for anything except the outside of violin backs, and my arch top back. I use catenary curves, the natural curve that happens when things bend, and can be used to give strength, like for bridges, and flat bed steel haulers; and instruments. Using a 2 foot long smooth chain I bought at Walmart, I find the arches in the design, and go from there. I tape the drawing on the doorwall in the dining room. Giant Lightbox. These are the arches when I was carving my arch top back: Attachment: IMG_0200.jpg The long arch was actually what developed when the two ACTUAL diagonal arches were joined together by the cross arches, but that's a whole other thing. You can see that the long arch of the plane fits in: Attachment: IMG_0202.jpg Here you can see how the long arch can be made with the plane I made. It might be slightly too big for the inside of the back, but it works for the inside of the belly, the outside of both, and everything on a cello. My design was just an idea of what "The First Arch Top" looked like when G. B. Guadagnini looked inside one of his sons flat top guitars, and seeing the ladder braces said, "Whats a matter you guy? Did you forget everything I taught you." So it is made like a small cello. Your design will probably be different, so use the drawing that you are using. Crosswise, you have the same thing: Attachment: IMG_0205.jpg For smaller instruments like violins, violas, carved mandolins, viols and the like; the little; well bigger than a finger plane, Lie Nielson concave plane works great for roughing, and semi-finishing. This is how it fits on the violin I'm building right now. It's WAY too small to consider using it to rough a guitar, let alone a cello! Attachment: IMG_0206.jpg Hope that helps. |
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