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| Make an Inlay http://mowrystrings.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=52255 |
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| Author: | Ruby50 [ Sat Aug 10, 2019 5:19 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Make an Inlay |
I enjoy sailing a lot and am a volunteer carpenter and sailor on 2 tall ships. My guitar logo is a 100 BC or so Greek anchor and I would like to inlay some rope around a rosette, up a fretboard, and then fastening to the anchor on the head. The first picture shows roughly what I am after - around the rosette once or maybe twice, up the fretboard while maybe forming a knot at the 12th fret, over the nut onto the head and knotted to the anchor. This string is just under 1/16" and the design is not developed The second picture is the only thing I can find that looks at all like what I am trying to do - this is from DePaule Pearl. It is about the right size at 1/8" wide and each piece is 1/4" long. The look is not exactly right and I am not sure it would go around tighter curves. The third shot is the detail needed - I am thinking that the pieces would be cut out of pearl, then the grooves cut with engraving tools. Does anyone know who might be able to make the pearl pieces for me? Thanks Ed |
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| Author: | SteveSmith [ Sat Aug 10, 2019 5:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
DePaule will probably do custom work if you can provide a decent drawing. They've done some stuff for me. |
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| Author: | Bri [ Sat Aug 10, 2019 6:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
Just throwing it out there, why not use string, sealed in with ca. Might be worth experimenting. B |
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| Author: | doncaparker [ Sat Aug 10, 2019 6:51 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
Andy DePaule can probably make whatever you want. It might cost some money. An alternative is to buy the pieces from Andy that he sells as rope, then just round off 2 corners per piece. Voila, you have string instead of rope. A tedious job, but really not hard. |
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| Author: | Freeman [ Sat Aug 10, 2019 7:24 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
Another vote for Andy (altho I think his son is running the business now). They have done several custom things for me. |
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| Author: | Clay S. [ Sun Aug 11, 2019 10:11 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
Another possibility for using shell is to cut pieces out of "curly" stuff which would eliminate the need to fit and match tiny individual pieces. |
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| Author: | Joe Beaver [ Sun Aug 11, 2019 3:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
DePaul for sure, but I like Clay's idea also. If you don't go to wide, you could use straight pieces for the gentler bends, just snap them in like purfling. May need to cut the curves into the sharper bends. I also like what Bri says. Very interesting. Use cording, cut a channel 1/2 the depth of the cord, flood with CA, Cut the the cord flush, reflood and sand flat? It might work |
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| Author: | Barry Daniels [ Sun Aug 11, 2019 5:45 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
String will never look reflective like shell. I don't think it would look good at all. |
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| Author: | Casey Cochran [ Sun Aug 11, 2019 10:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
David Mathis. mathisguitars.com I don't see any of his custom inlay work posted on his site yet, but he recently did a run of peghead overlays for me and I am VERY pleased. |
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| Author: | rbuddy [ Sun Aug 11, 2019 11:18 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
You can get a variety of silver wire like - https://www.riogrande.com/product/sterling-silver-pattern-wire-dead-soft/102114 or https://www.riogrande.com/product/sterling-silver-pattern-wire-dead-soft/102108 You might find something that would work for your application. Could be hammered or drawn flatter if necessary. I've used silver in inlay and it has worked pretty well. Brian |
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| Author: | Bri [ Mon Aug 12, 2019 9:46 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
Or how about using copper or silver wire? Like this; https://images.app.goo.gl/KeHbwV9nzfG4NW2N9 |
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| Author: | Bryan Bear [ Mon Aug 12, 2019 2:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
If you are going to use wire for the rope, you could tie the anchor theme further into the guitar theme and use a wound guitar string. |
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| Author: | Jim Watts [ Mon Aug 12, 2019 5:20 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
You could use a silver wound classical guitar string set in clear epoxy. |
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| Author: | Clay S. [ Mon Aug 12, 2019 10:20 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
I remembered I had an old zither back in a closet covered in dust that had a stylized pearl "rope" purfling. Slightly different than what is typically called "rope" on guitars, but in some ways more rope-like. I wiped the dust off and took a picture. |
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| Author: | Luthier1975 [ Tue Aug 13, 2019 7:16 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
You can get square silver stock for inlay. It's just like the round wire but square so it would go into an inlay rout easier. |
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| Author: | Ruby50 [ Tue Aug 13, 2019 7:31 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
Boy - the ideas are flying fast and free here. What a great group. I am starting to think that a guitar string would look great - hint of rope and hint of guitar. The first picture is one that is not silver colored, but they come in nickel and yes in silver. I want something bigger than .060 that a large 6 string guitar string might come, so I looked at bass strings, and they are available up to .130, although .09 or so might be appropriate. The only problem is that I would not want to sand any of the windings for a flat spot, so it would have to be inlaid a little more than its final depth to allow an epoxy surround. This would be tough when my rough top might be a little big of .14 or .15. The cut would go most all the way through. Eventually it could have a doubler on the inside, but handling it in that period between inlaying, through thicknessing might get sticky, but the epoxy might be enough to make it sturdy like a glued-up back strip. Also, cutting fret slots through it - i would have to find the right size hacksaw blade. My wife has a small jewelry studio and I have inlaid sterling silver before - the second shot is my logo in silver on ebony. I have also used epoxy to cover some bling - the third picture is some gold glitter with clear epoxy over it. This all looks doable if I can figure out how to handle the top thickness issue Thanks to all - much food for thought Ed |
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| Author: | Clay S. [ Tue Aug 13, 2019 11:30 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
"Also, cutting fret slots through it - i would have to find the right size hacksaw blade." If you use a nylon cored harp guitar string you may be able to cut through it with just a regular back saw. You can buy singles up to .080". http://www.harpguitarmusic.com/strings-nylon.htm |
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| Author: | Ruby50 [ Tue Aug 13, 2019 1:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
Great idea Clay. Thinking this morning, a Dremel with a cut-off wheel would be great for cutting them once inlaid in the fretboard as you could make the immediate area a little wider than the fret tang so there was no binding of the fret wire in the slot. These harp guitar sub bass strings are silver wound on a nylon core. If I bent the wire, would it stay in that shape? I know the wire cored string would hold the shape, but would the nylon cored? The knot I am thinking of at the 12th fret is a double carrick bend that looks like the shot below. I am thinking I could bend the two sides, then cut pieces out where they pass over each other, then inlay, but that would only work if the wire held its shape. |
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| Author: | mcgr40 [ Tue Aug 13, 2019 3:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
Seems like on the top thickness problem, you could thin the back side of the wire before inlay by cuttting a groove in board to hold the wire tight, sand off the extra thickness, then inlay this "thinned flat wire rope". I wonder if the flattened side might look as nice as the rounded side, or even better. |
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| Author: | Clay S. [ Tue Aug 13, 2019 3:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
The nylon cored string will hold it's shape better than string, but not as stiffly as steel strings. It may take the shape you want better than a steel string and look more like rope. I have tied knots in nylon strings to use them with pin type bridges. The harp guitar strings I have used I tried to keep straight so I'm uncertain how stiff they would be. They could probably be flattened more than steel strings, so may not need to be cut where one string passes over another. Before commiting to an $8 to $10 Harp string you might want to buy a $1 nylon low E string locally and see if it acts the way you need it to. |
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| Author: | Steve Marcq [ Fri Aug 16, 2019 12:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
Why not use a silver chain from a necklace, CA'd into a tight groove? It's already chain after all. |
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| Author: | Ruby50 [ Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:27 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
Chain might work. There are plenty of patterns to choose from to be sure it looks loke "chain" Ed |
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| Author: | Aaron O [ Tue Aug 20, 2019 3:58 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
Imho, not every inlay needs to be shiny, or even exact. Sometimes its about representation. If I were doing this rope, I'd probably grab some curly maple, and cut it as Clay mentioned above. In order to get the detail, I'd make it big, and run it off and on the fretboard, and engrave a la scrimshaw for detail. |
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| Author: | DennisK [ Tue Aug 20, 2019 5:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
Ruby50 wrote: These harp guitar sub bass strings are silver wound on a nylon core. If I bent the wire, would it stay in that shape? I know the wire cored string would hold the shape, but would the nylon cored? The knot I am thinking of at the 12th fret is a double carrick bend that looks like the shot below. I am thinking I could bend the two sides, then cut pieces out where they pass over each other, then inlay, but that would only work if the wire held its shape. Yep, they hold their shape. But even if they didn't, a tight fitting channel would force them into shape. Regarding fret slots, I would route the inlay channel first, then cut the fret slots, then inlay the string. Dremel wheel is worth a shot for cutting through the string, but those are always a pain not being able to get a square cut due to the body of the dremel being in the way. A diamond coated dremel bit could also potentially work (you can get a big set of them on ebay for a couple bucks). In either case, the heat generated by grinding may be a problem. Water really helps with the diamond bits, but would stain the wood with metal dust. A hacksaw really might be better for the first pass, and then just a touch of diamond bit to widen it out. Jeweler's saw also might be able to cut guitar string, I'm not sure. |
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| Author: | Ruby50 [ Wed Aug 21, 2019 8:57 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Make an Inlay |
Thanks for the thoughts Dennis I thought I would radius, cut groove , cut slots, inlay, fret This will be very interesting Ed |
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