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| Author: | jshelton [ Thu Jun 28, 2018 6:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | synthetic fingerboards |
We received our first two "ebano" fingerboards from RC Tonewoods today. My initial impression is entirely positive. They are black, uniform and best of all light weight. What a hit! No waiting for years for unstable ebony to cure, no cupping, no warping, ready to use. It strikes me that they are not quite as hard as ebony, more comparable to East Indian but considering the positives that is just fine. If they work as advertised no more ebony for us! |
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| Author: | Haans [ Fri Jun 29, 2018 11:04 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
So, it is some kind of wood subjected to some kind of process? Does it have a grain? Pores? |
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| Author: | jshelton [ Fri Jun 29, 2018 1:22 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
Haans wrote: So, it is some kind of wood subjected to some kind of process? Does it have a grain? Pores? I understand it's a wood product with some sort of binding agent like a an epoxy or poly that's black. No obvious grain or pores. I haven't done any milling on them yet so don't know how the dust is. I find milling/sanding ebony to be very unpleasant due to the noxious odor and irritating dust. Even with the dust collection on, an exhaust fan running and a respirator and glasses it's hard to prevent that one little puff of ebony dust that makes your eyes and nose feel like they're on fire. |
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| Author: | Chris Pile [ Fri Jun 29, 2018 2:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
Gibson uses a premium engineered material made from wood and resin, marketed as Richlite. Ebano is made by Rocklite, as I understand. They start with larger pieces of wood than Richlite. But the process for making both is similar - heat and pressure yield a dense material suitable for fingerboards, etc. |
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| Author: | Joe Beaver [ Fri Jun 29, 2018 2:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
I haven't given the product a good look until I saw your post. I checked out RC Tonewood's site and was very impressed. Bob's stuff actually looks like high grade ebony, grain lines and all. Once I run out of finger boards I'll give it a try. I look forward to your experience with it. |
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| Author: | DannyV [ Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
My 2 pennies. I have used it for head plates and like it a lot. No pores and it doesn't fuzz up when cutting an inlay pocket. It's well priced. I've recently used it as binding. Much prefer the behaviour of wood. Working and finishing. I will only use it in the future as a last resort. It does bend well. I have a FB but will likely not use it. I have heard that it crumbles pulling frets. And after working with it it feels like high grade particle board. I believe I've heard a higher end builder mention he liked it a lot as a bridge material. I have a blank and I may test it out on the next one I do for myself. |
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| Author: | Clay S. [ Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
"Ebano is made by Rocklite, as I understand. They start with larger pieces of wood than Richlite." Richlite is essentially a Phenolic material - Paper infused with resin. I don't think it has any wood. I made countertops out of it. You can get it in 5 ft X12 ft sheets up to 3 inches thick (you might need a crane to move it!). Routing it produces a fine greasy black dust that likes to stick to everything. It is very stabile - I made a front rail for my tablesaw with it. |
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| Author: | Chris Pile [ Fri Jun 29, 2018 4:17 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
Quote: Richlite is essentially a Phenolic material - Paper infused with resin. I don't think it has any wood. Gee, it's too bad they don't make paper out of wood anymore. |
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| Author: | Clay S. [ Fri Jun 29, 2018 6:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
"Paper" has been made out of many different things over the years, wood being a major source of material in modern papers. But after it is made into paper I no longer consider it to be wood. |
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| Author: | phavriluk [ Fri Jun 29, 2018 7:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
Merchant sure appreciates this stuff. Real ebony costs substantially less from the same vendor. Please, where's the advantage in a manufactured substitute that costs more than the real material it's replacing? |
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| Author: | jshelton [ Fri Jun 29, 2018 8:39 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
phavriluk wrote: Merchant sure appreciates this stuff. Real ebony costs substantially less from the same vendor. Please, where's the advantage in a manufactured substitute that costs more than the real material it's replacing? The advantage is that it's ready to use. You don't have to wait years for it to cure to avoid the inevitable cupping, warping or checking. I've used ebony for fingerboards for about 50 years, it is a notoriously unstable wood. BTW, try to find an ebony fingerboard nowadays that is quartered. If it isn't quartered you risk the quite common effect of checks in the top on each side of the fingerboard caused by it's shrinkage. I agree that these synthetic fingerboards are very expensive but sometimes it's cheaper to spend the money up front to avoid some unpleasant consequences down the road. I hope these boards are everything they're supposed to be, I have no experience with them at this point but I'm about to find out. Believe me, if they don't work out I'll be the first to complain. |
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| Author: | phavriluk [ Sat Jun 30, 2018 7:41 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
Thanks to 'jshelton' for a very clear explanation. Sounds good to me. Also sounds like my not having bought any real ebony fingerboards was a good idea. Much obliged. |
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| Author: | Danl8 [ Sat Jun 30, 2018 8:08 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
Richlite is also used by Martin on the lower part of their product range. I've used one Richlite fingerboard and bridge and found it to be excellent material. If I didn't have a lifetime supply of ebony, I would switch. |
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| Author: | Greg Maxwell [ Sat Jun 30, 2018 8:45 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
I've used Rocklite Ebano for head plates, fretboards, and bridges. It works well, is stable, and is jet black. Once it is sanded to 400 or so and oiled, it is nearly indistinguishable from Ebony. And as mentioned it is much lighter in weight. Hardness is about the same as EIR. 
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| Author: | Danl8 [ Sat Jun 30, 2018 11:17 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
Hopefully not wandering too far from the OP's original question, has anybody used Rocklite Ebano for bindings? I noticed on their website that the manufacturer sells bindings, which would be most interesting application of this material. |
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| Author: | Haans [ Sat Jun 30, 2018 11:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
DannyV wrote: I have heard that it crumbles pulling frets. And after working with it it feels like high grade particle board. That would have sent me running...away. |
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| Author: | Colin North [ Sat Jun 30, 2018 2:55 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
Haans wrote: DannyV wrote: I have heard that it crumbles pulling frets. And after working with it it feels like high grade particle board. That would have sent me running...away. I've done a refret on a Martin with a Rocklite Ebano fretboard and saw no sign of it crumbling at all. A little heat with a soldering iron and they slipped out fine, no chips or tear-out. Next set of Evo's went in well. |
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| Author: | Greg Maxwell [ Sat Jun 30, 2018 4:02 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
Yes for bindings. Bends easily. Bears no resemblance to particle board. |
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| Author: | truckjohn [ Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
My only issue is that it's more expensive than ebony - which is already more expensive than most other fingerboard wood. If it was similar in price to EIR - I don't think I would use anything else unless I was doing it for looks... |
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| Author: | Goodin [ Sat Jun 30, 2018 10:30 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
I look forward to hearing about your impressions of ebano John. I am about to string up a bouzouki that I made with a Blackwood Tek fingerboard. It is made by a Spanish company called Madinter. I don't personally know of anyone in the USA who has built an instrument using Blackwood Tek. I will report back. |
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| Author: | Michaeldc [ Sun Jul 01, 2018 8:39 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
DannyV wrote: My 2 pennies. I have used it for head plates and like it a lot. No pores and it doesn't fuzz up when cutting an inlay pocket. It's well priced. I've recently used it as binding. Much prefer the behaviour of wood. Working and finishing. I will only use it in the future as a last resort. It does bend well. I have a FB but will likely not use it. I have heard that it crumbles pulling frets. And after working with it it feels like high grade particle board. I believe I've heard a higher end builder mention he liked it a lot as a bridge material. I have a blank and I may test it out on the next one I do for myself. Howdy sir, Are you using Richlite or Rocklite? M |
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| Author: | jshelton [ Sun Jul 01, 2018 9:26 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
Goodin wrote: I look forward to hearing about your impressions of ebano John. I am about to string up a bouzouki that I made with a Blackwood Tek fingerboard. It is made by a Spanish company called Madinter. I don't personally know of anyone in the USA who has built an instrument using Blackwood Tek. I will report back. I'm quite familiar with Madinter. Blackwood Tek is substantially less expensive than Rocklite ebano. I'll have to give it a try. Thanks for the reference. |
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| Author: | Michaeldc [ Thu Jul 12, 2018 9:49 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
I've been talking with Madinter and the factory that makes Blackwood Tek in China. Madinter will not offer free shipping at any volume to the US so I've got 10 sets (FB, bridge blank, headplates) coming from China for evaluation. I'll report back when it gets here. |
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| Author: | meddlingfool [ Thu Jul 12, 2018 10:17 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
I've been curious about the TEK. Shame shipping is so damned high from Spain. |
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| Author: | Michaeldc [ Thu Jul 12, 2018 10:25 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: synthetic fingerboards |
meddlingfool wrote: I've been curious about the TEK. Shame shipping is so damned high from Spain. Ed, I can send you a set to check out when it shows up. M |
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