Official Luthiers Forum!

... but I want to get it right the first time!

It's a long story, but this guitar was given to me by a friend to practice on. At the time, he had painted it a horrid textured purple (don't get me started). That was over 10 years ago - most of that time it has set unused. Fast forward to about 2 months ago when my 6 year old started taking lessons, and guess what - her dad decided to pick it up again too. It didn't take long before I was so frustrated with the instrument that I was in the basement stripping the purple off. Besides the paint, it also has a severely cracked bridge (in '63, LG0's came with a plastic bridge) and some cracks on the back of the body running with the grain. It's all mahogany, and the new bridge is black walnut.

Today, the purple is gone (yay!), I've glued and pressed the cracks, and have spend countless hours working the wood with fine steel wool. At the moment, it's looking pretty good, and I'm trying to get ready for the next steps. I've also been doing a TON of reading and asking questions. I've learned a lot, but there are still some holes and I think this looks like a good group to bounce this off of

1> fitting the bridge - I have the replacement, but need to shape it a bit as the soundboard is a bit 'bellied'
2> attach the bridge - I have hide glue and the original to use for location, just gotta get clamps deep enough
3> ream the peg holes to the right size
4> apply grain filler - I've watched Todd's YouTube videos and I think I can manage that now that I know to apply the epoxy to the bare wood
5> paint the headstock and apply new graphic - I'm going to paint the face black and put the logo on. Will a vinyl decal cause issues under nitrocellulose lacquer?
6> finishing the neck - I haven't found a lot of info here, but I gather that an oil finish (tung oil, tru-oil...) may be preferred to lacquer?
7> sealer and lacquer coats on the body - I've found a lot of info on this, but am unclear as to how to finish the bridge. Does it get sealed an lacquered like the body? or an oil finish like the neck?
8> reattach hardware and strings.

thoughts? corrections? questions?

Yo, white

me don't use nirto, so don't know about the decal.

finishes are a personal persuasion...choose what ever spins your wheels

But now that you have had steel wool on that sucker. DO NOT, repeat, do not use a water born finish as the steel wool leaves all sorts of micro slivers that might just rust out and turn into the spoted black plague that infest the entire surface in a matter of minutes. Some claim that a spray of shellac can prevent it....to that me say

Oh and regarding "getting it right"...

There ain't no right and there ain't no wrong! All there is, is the is and the consequences of our choice. But thats metaphysics 101 and this is OFL so don't pay any attention to me babblings.

blessings
the
Padma

_________________
.

Audiences and dispensations on Thursdays ~ by appointment only.


.

A few suggestions- but I'm strictly an amateur at this stuff, so don't take me too seriously!


Shaping should be easy-tape sandpaper to the top. Perhaps consider an ebony bridge? (Get that black plastic look!)

Make sure you get the bare top wood exposed and uncontaminated by paint stripper, old finish, etc. You can improvise clamping arrangements if necessary (bolts through bridge pin holes with a caul, and many others- just make sure you are supporting the top properly. Even heavy clamps can 'crank' the top enough to damage.

Don't forget ramps/slots for the strings

Sometimes the original filler will be left behind, depending on how careful you were with the stripping job. Are there pores showing?

Best to get a few decals and test. Sometimes a 'mist' coat or two is helpful.

Lacquer is fine for necks, but oil does work. If you can find some scrap mahogany, do some tests - including your pore filling.

It's easier to get the top finish flat if the bridge is glued after the finish is done. Lots of options on this one- keep reading...
Generally, steel string bridges are not finished 'shiny', so probably oil is the route to go. Often 'fingerboard oil' is all that is required for the bridge. With ebony or rosewood, just sanding can do it for many folks. Lacquer would tend to chip, etc from the wear and tear of string pressure, I think.
Good project- I had a LG1 and replaced the plastic bridge with ebony, 'back in the day'...
Cheers
John

Great tips - thanks, John! Looks like I posted this in the wrong part of the forum - this is neither a video nor a tutorial.


I do have a replacement already - but I do like the idea of ebonizing it with some oil-based stain.


Oh yeah, we're down to the grain and open pores. It had been stripped prior to it's previous paint job (the one I removed). Was really more a matter of getting the paint out of the pores.


Ahhhh, test pieces.... i may have some to try this out on.


Now this is starting to make sense... So the same oil sealer I use for the neck, I could use on the bridge. So if I attach the bridge after finishing the top, then would I mask that area, or have to remove that finish later before attaching the bridge?

I've done it both ways, and I prefer not to mask. If you put masking tape down, the top isn't 'flat' any more and it causes problems when sanding the finish flat before buffing, I've found.

Better to just finish the top and then scrape the finish away where you will glue. Be careful not to 'scribe' too deeply around the bridge- you can weaken the top wood and provide a nice line for the bridge to peel off with a thin layer of top attached.


You might be able to get the discussion moved to the Guitar Building forum if you send a pm to one of the sysops/admin guys here.

Cheers
John

I'm certainly not a repair expert, but I do have an old LGO that I pulled the back off of some years ago before I decided to put it away till I felt like I sort of knew what I was doing. Make sure and inspect the inside for structural damage. If your bridge was split there's a very good chance the bridge plate on the inside has been compromised, too. You might also have some loose braces. You might also have neck angle issues if the body has distorted that much, which is common on these older ladder braced guitars, so a neck reset could be in order.

I also had to deal with some pretty poor repair attempts which resulted in the top being flooded with thick epoxy which was a bear to remove. I think they were trying to sister in a brace next to one that had split.

Just for grins, here's what I started with.

_________________
______________________________
Jonathan Kendall, Siloam Springs AR

Good point. One option (if you must put the bridge in the same location for cosmetic reasons) is to cut the saddle slot after gluing the bridge to the top.
Don Teeter's book shows how to do this with a Dremel+simple jig, and it does work. That's what I did when I replaced the (plastic) bridge on my LG1 with an ebony replacement.

Cheers
John

good point, may as well check that before replacing it.


No worries here.


I'm planning for 5 - I can always take more off if I need to.


Right. I've since found places that will make nice (not inkjet) waterslide decals, which looks like the way to go.


I'm trying to find a local place that sells Tru-oil - anyone know what retailers carry this stuff? Shipping usually comes out to be more than the product.


check. Will use oil finish as well.


Another good point. I'll get a mirror and inspect it tonight.



Big thanks!

Wow, what a mess. Mine got a bit of a grope when I removed the bridge. Never felt anything like that in there, but I'll have a look tonight and give it a good inspection.

I'm rather optimistic about the rest of the struture. The plastic bridge was in lousy shape, but since the previous owner mounted it over the top of this ridiculous heavy texture paint (think rough orange peel), I think that was the main culpret. It didn't have a firm fit to the soundboard and one of the screws was missing (like the one in your pic). Thus the poor fit put a lot of extra stress on the already failing plastic bridge.

But I'll check it out. Thanks!

Sea:
Tru oil is sold at most Woodcraft stores, they seem to be almost everywhere. The most common use for Tru oil is on gunstocks so try gunsmiths, or large sporting goods stores. Also try to get a fresh bottle as it does get old on the shelf in a small store..... Mikey

_________________
The Biggest Little City, Nevada
www.hammondguitars.com
I love building guitars!

I suspect the bellying on the top may be caused by bridgeplate problems. The old LGO's were ladder braced, and had a spruce bridgeplate. Here's an old bridgeplate out of one, as well as the plastic bridge.

_________________
I didn't mean to say it, but I meant what I said.
http://www.brackettinstruments.com/