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Taylor routing a perimeter v grove?
http://mowrystrings.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=16715		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Frei [ Thu Apr 03, 2008 5:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Taylor routing a perimeter v grove?
I just tried out some new Taylors today, well, I started with a Larrive dred, and it was dead, I moved on to a smaller Taylor Sapele [:Y:] cutaway, wow, this thing rocked. Now Im depressed, Im not gonna do anything like this in 3 years.

But the sales guy said that Taylor was using a 1/16 v-grove around the perimeter to make it more flexible. Is this whats up at Taylor? the thing needed an adi top, because it was overly loud, and would bung up to a degree when pounded. For the price it was a nice sitka/sapele guitar. Very nice.
Author:  Alan Carruth [ Thu Apr 03, 2008 5:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Taylor routing a perimeter v grove?
Frei wrote:
"....the thing needed an adi top, because it was overly loud, and would bung up to a degree when pounded."

I don't think that's only the top: you can build 'headroom' into any wood if you do it right. They didn't, although maybe headroom wasn't what they were after.

A lot of hand makers taper the thickness of the top around the edges. There are lots of theories as to what that does to the sound, but everybosdy would agree it does something, I guess. If you are using a drum sander to thickness the top it's hard to get some kinds of taper: you can make the 'wings' thin and the center thicker, but thinning toward the tailblock is harder to do. I'm sure Bob could figure out a way if he wanted to, but probably that little groove has almost the same effect, and it's quicker to do with his tooling. Remember, he's not out to make the 'best' guitar, but the 'best at this price point', and the constraints in a production setting are severe. He can't afford to sit and contemplate and fuss with details as much as we can.
Author:  Frei [ Thu Apr 03, 2008 6:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Taylor routing a perimeter v grove?
Right but if its an unbroken perimeter, (I think it might not be, off the top of my head) that means its pretty darn thin doesnt it? This thing rocked for $1500.00!
Author:  Steve Walden [ Fri Apr 04, 2008 9:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Taylor routing a perimeter v grove?
I've got a DDAE Taylor (X12 shape) that is about two years old. When I put a light inside and looked at the bracing through the top you can see the groove on the perimeter of the lower bout. I think it is a round bottomed groove and not a V shape.

Also, at a Taylor store event a year and a half ago they were showing a braced top with this round bottomed perimeter groove.
Author:  Steve Saville [ Fri Apr 04, 2008 10:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Taylor routing a perimeter v grove?
I'm pretty sure it is not a V groove. It is a U shaped groove.

Frei,
Don't be so hard on yourself. You'll be able to make something you like as well or more in less than 3 yours.
Author:  Michael Dale Payne [ Fri Apr 04, 2008 10:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Taylor routing a perimeter v grove?
The minimum thickness at the bottom of the U grove is something like .085-.090" this allows them to use a thicker top over all and still have it very active in the lower bout. The u-channel is only in the lower bout and tapers out before the waist.
Author:  Frei [ Fri Apr 04, 2008 10:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Taylor routing a perimeter v grove?
Man, you learn something every day. Is Sapele a 'darker' sounding wood than Honduran Mahogany?

I guess I have read about luthiers going to .90 on the outer edge. Very interesting way to solve the problem of hand scraping on mass scale.
Author:  Steve Saville [ Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Taylor routing a perimeter v grove?
Frei wrote:
Is Sapele a 'darker' sounding wood than Honduran Mahogany.
They are very similar - it depends on the individual piece.



Frei wrote:
.....I guess I have read about luthiers going to .90 on the outer edge....

I have made entire tops thinner than .090. Its no big deal if you brace properly.
This U groove is a nice solution for the mass production environment. I don't think it is something small shop builders will do, or more importantly, need to do.
Author:  Mattia Valente [ Sat Apr 05, 2008 6:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Taylor routing a perimeter v grove?
They're very similar, although very generally Sapele is heavier, stiffer, and rings out a little more than honduran. It's not dissimilar to the sets of Cuban mahogany I've got in terms of taptone and feel, although it looks quite different.
Author:  Frei [ Sun Apr 06, 2008 12:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Taylor routing a perimeter v grove?
Mattia Valente wrote:
They're very similar, although very generally Sapele is heavier, stiffer, and rings out a little more than honduran. It's not dissimilar to the sets of Cuban mahogany I've got in terms of taptone and feel, although it looks quite different.


Hm, I have not played a cuban mahogany, but I have a set, and I would buy a ton more if I could, the tone is unlike Mahogany, its really bright, but a bit of woodyness.

I always thought of Sapele as the poor mans mahogany because of my Tahoma DM-9, but the Taylor was much more red in color. Very nice sound,

Also got the name of a local luthier who is up and coming. It was a good day.

Thanks
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