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I recently purchased a premise saddle from a vendor I’m not familiar with. Upon inspection I found the slot is tilted toward the pins .
At first I figured it was an error in their setup, but upon thinking about it I wondered if it is suppose to help correct the tilting forward of the bridge under tension.... I’ve not heard back from said seller.

Is tilting the slot back in order to achieve a vertical saddle under tension a thing?


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a lot of makers are doing this.
But saddle & slot done right does not to be tilted.

Mike

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Mike Collins

I watched a Youtube video by Rick Turner where he had done this.

So it accomplishes.....?
The top of the saddle being in the correct place instead of being pulled forward and creating an intonation problem?


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One Idea behind the tilted saddle is that as you change the action it compensates for the compensation - i.e. - as you raise the action you need more compensation, and as you lower the action you need less. Shaving the saddle down will move the contact point of the strings forward a little bit if the saddle is tilted. I generally tilt the slot rather than the saddle which accomplishes the same thing. Tilting the slot causes the saddle to tilt so a repair person doesn't have to find a saddle tilted to the right degree.
These are small tweaks which assume the saddle slot is in the right place to start with.
It may also help distribute the forces on the saddle better, but as Mike Collins said, with a properly made bridge and saddle that is not a problem.

I do it. Drill the holes and route the slot while the bridge blank is rectangular, and then taper the thickness toward the back end, removing material from the underside so it tilts everything back in the process. Not very much, just enough to be sure it's not tilted forward under tension, reducing pressure on the front wall of the slot (less chance of developing splits at the ends of the slot) and increasing pressure on the bottom (good for UST pickups). But I don't consider it to be particularly important, just a minor improvement with no drawbacks.

I can't imagine how you would tilt the saddle, but not the slot.

I have been thinking about doing a tilt back also, but I made this really cool jig that would not work to route a tilted slot. Great idea with shaving the bottom of the bridge Dennis.

One more note: I have heard many people mention using a 7° tilt. when I eyeball it, it looks more like a 2-3° to make it vertical. That's on a typical rotation that you see, not extreme. Are some people actually tilting it backwards??

Pat

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Pat

That is such a simple and elegant solution I love it!

Ever since I heard about this idea of tilting the saddle years ago I thought it was brilliant. But I've been using the same saddle slot jig I built in 1990 till this day and have been too lazy to make a new one. Plus as someone mentioned above a titled saddle is by no means necessary to get everything right but... That's something I just might give a try next time round...

When the strings go over the top of the saddle they push on it with a force that is determined by the tension on the strings and the break angle. The more break angle the larger the force. The force itself runs in a direction that bisects the break angle; it's pushing the top of the saddle both downward and forward (toward the neck). As the break angle gets higher the tipping force can get quite large: at a 45 degree break the tipping force is 70% of the total tension on the strings. This is what breaks out the front of the slot, or deforms it into a 'D' shape.

If you tilt the saddle back it reduces this force. If the saddle tilt actually bisects the break angle there is no net tipping force on it. This is how fiddles get away with those tall, skinny bridges without them tipping over warping out of shape; the center line of the bridge pretty well bisects the break angle.

Rick Turner says that a nine degree back angle is just enough to automatically adjust the compensation as the saddle height is raised or lowered. I can't vouch for the exactness of that, but it helps.

Tipping the saddle back also increases the download on the bottom of the slot, which can help the sound of a UST.

I rout the slot by putting a nine degree wedge under the bridge blank, using my drill press as a milling machine. I put a wedge on the front of the bridge blank with double stick tape to get the compensation angle.

all these comments are very helpful. I appreciate the insight ... I'll have to see how much of an angle is actually built into the slot... if 5-9 degrees is in there I may still try it.

I've done it in my regular saddle slotting jig by putting a piece of binding under the peg edge of the bridge blank. Not sure of the degree of angle but it worked fine for me.

A little dated, but here's my jig.

I like to cut saddle slots after the bridge is glued on the guitar. To tilt the slot I just shim up one side of the simple jig I use. For through saddle ukulele bridges I use a table saw and slot long lengths of material to cut the saddle slot and the tie block "trough". I angle the saw blade to cut the ramp of the trough.

So those of you that use a tilted slot, do you position the bridge so that the top of the slot is in the same place as if it wasn't tilted?

Kevin Looker

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I'm not a luthier.
I'm just a guy who builds guitars in his basement.
It's better than playing golf.

You should give the - slot - a little less compensation. You want the -top of the saddle - to give the proper compensation according to the height of the action you have set. The idea being that as the saddle is raised or lowered the compensation is compensated to account for it.
If you adjust the action by tilting the neck (not adjusting saddle height) then picking a middle of the road compensation and not bothering to tilt the saddle is probably as good a method as any.